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[Tony Bones]

If it helps, I know exactly what you mean by all of it. Ultimate truth is there, and I suspect that we all knew it all along, and just chose to forget because we need to spend more time basting in the beautiful suffering that is the human experience. It's how the soul builds itself, refining and purifying with each pass, with each set of experiences. One analogy is a block of marble slowly being chipped at until the Athenian statue potentially within is revealed. Or it might be like a candle-maker, dipping and dipping the wick to create something wonderful out of the bubbling mass of molten wax.

Excellent answer! Most people tend to busy themselves with pointless distractions. It's sad really. They'll never know the satisfaction of uncovering Truth and the beauty it holds. (I'm starting to get the hang of this quoting thing  )

[Tony Bones]

Hmm... Raliel seems to have solipsism issues...lol

[The Angel Raliel]

n ot really feeling up to long and philosophical replies today...sorry, but if you can be bothered to trawl through the Religion god faith thread (poss near the beginning)| lay down quite extensively my views on the suspected interconnectedness of all thing in space and time

[Pandora]

This is a fascinating thread. I can't really think of anything to say right now, but it's definitely made me think.

[Morpheus Laughing]

Are we really all that different?

Yes and no. It depends what qualities you are measuring. As a general rule I'd agree. If we were very different from each other, or if we merely assumed we were very different, we wouldn’t seriously entertain the question. i.e. I can’t personally see significant similarities between myself and rocks (unless I digress radically from a direct comparison) but I can see certain shared similarities between myself and other sentient creatures which others do not see or will not take seriously.

However...We tend to filter out common similarities so that we can focus on crucial shifts in our environments and it’s also the case that we use perceived differences to bolster our egos and provide ourselves with dubious reasons for justifying our nonessential desires/preferences. This makes for inequalities and non-trivial differences between ourselves that have massive effects on net wellbeing. It’s often these types of relative differences (and the associated consequences) that are of the most pressing interest to us.

In these times we turn to our minds to make sense of it all, to figure out some reason that makes it all okay and enables us to finally lay our burden down. This fruitless quest drives many to madness, suicide, or self-deception. It's a sad state of affairs, but it's reality. Is this the reason for the subtle pessimism that pervades most of our thoughts (and posts) and saying we're happy despite the circumstances is just an attempt to convince ourselves it's so?

Ah… I’ve been down that road but for now I’m content to say that I’m pessimistic because I see that kind of thing happening in others (as well as the other types of suffering) and because it looks set to continue until the sun fizzles out.

Everything that lives must die. It's beautiful, it really is.

I’m more inclined to say that it is tragic. It's certainly a waste of delicate sentience and the end of life is rarely a departure as graceful as one might hope for.

I hate people for wasting even a single moment of our wonderful gift of life. I hate organized religion for telling us what to believe instead of letting us find it out for ourselves. I hate this capitalistic government that forces us to work meaningless jobs for long hours and little pay, robbing us of our right to truly live as we should. I hate pollution and those who pollute for killing this planet, our mother, who bore us all. I think you see where I'm going here. And most of all I hate myself.

I hate myself for being human, for needing to take, consume, and waste, and not having a choice in the matter. For being weak, and for not being able to fix everything and everyone.

I mostly agree except I’d replace the word “wonderful” with “white elephant.” I don’t really hate myself but I consider my presence on this planet to be superfluous for similar reasons you give in the second quote.

[Mister Sahara]

Isn't making generalized statements based on poor information all we can ever do?

[Agonistes]

Isn't making generalized statements based on poor information all we can ever do?

but if that were the case then philosophy, religion, theoreticals........all would be, at their core, educated guesses.....oh.

[Tony Bones]

Isn't making generalized statements based on poor information all we can ever do?

EXACTLY!!!!! So glad you picked up on that! I choose nearly all my words with great care. Nothing makes me happier than when someone picks up on something like that. This just made my night. Thank you.

[Agonistes]

Isn't making generalized statements based on poor information all we can ever do?

EXACTLY!!!!! So glad you picked up on that! I choose nearly all my words with great care. Nothing makes me happier than when someone picks up on something like that. This just made my night. Thank you.

it's my rare pleasure.  that's actually a really important idea to me.....the fact that morality in general comes from others who are, the same as me, making it all up as they go along.  some are attempts at definition or explanation for the things that make us wonder up at the stars or whatever, but bearing that in mind makes it easy to root out the explanations that have, at their core, methods of control or persuasion outside the realm of free thought.

[Mister Sahara]

Isn't making generalized statements based on poor information all we can ever do?

but if that were the case then philosophy, religion, theoreticals........all would be, at their core, educated guesses.....oh.

yeah... and after thousands of years of philosophizing we still keep doing it...

Isn't making generalized statements based on poor information all we can ever do?

EXACTLY!!!!! So glad you picked up on that! I choose nearly all my words with great care. Nothing makes me happier than when someone picks up on something like that. This just made my night. Thank you.

 

[Tony Bones]

Here's a fun thought.

If reality is what we make it (I'm talking quantum physics here) and we conversely create the world around us while it creates us, what happens when enough of us are sick of life this way? What if at some point, enough people want something different so badly that it has to change? Would reality instantly align itself to our new system of beliefs? Because this shit ain't working.

[Agonistes]

Here's a fun thought.

If reality is what we make it (I'm talking quantum physics here) and we conversely create the world around us while it creates us, what happens when enough of us are sick of life this way? What if at some point, enough people want something different so badly that it has to change? Would reality instantly align itself to our new system of beliefs? Because this shit ain't working.

human malaise has been around for aeons.  i'd look at the symptoms in the past, and how it has changed before in order to understand how it can change now.

[yosmark]

Here's a fun thought.

If reality is what we make it (I'm talking quantum physics here) and we conversely create the world around us while it creates us, what happens when enough of us are sick of life this way? What if at some point, enough people want something different so badly that it has to change? Would reality instantly align itself to our new system of beliefs? Because this shit ain't working.

No.

[Tony Bones]

http://wimp.com/quantumapocalypse/