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Author Topic: Pedophila Today  (Read 25193 times)

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Mockery

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Pedophila Today
« on: July 19, 2011, 02:46:57 PM »

I watch Law and Order: SVU all the time and I recently watched two episodes that dealt with pedophiles.

First, there was a group that was trying to get pedophilc relationships legal and they were arguing that they were being discriminated against like black people and gay people were a long time ago.  Now when I first heard that, it made me mad because those are two different things. Skin is something you can't change but being a pedophile is a sickness that causes you to think taking a child innocence is okay. A child does not understand the concepts of love and sex.

The second episode was even worse because it involved a guy who was trying to convince Stabler (one of the detectives) that the love he had for little girls was as pure as being married with an adult. It made me mad to realize that people are actually like that.

So what do you think? Lets begin the debate!
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The Angel Raliel

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2011, 02:56:38 PM »

simple answer....I think paedophilia is not a choice in the same way manic depression or other innate behavioural disorders are not a choice........(not the same as homosexuality is not a choice as that is perfectly healthy and generally involves perfectly consentual sex between two adults) any activity that involves corruption of innocents in this way is wrong but should be treated as mental illness rather than criminality as criminal punishment does very little to deal with the real issues involved
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2011, 03:07:47 PM »

So people who rape children shouldn't go to jail?
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slyvia k

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2011, 03:13:26 PM »

i'm sorry, my eyes just popped to the ''being gay is a choice'' part, and while i certainly won't kill you, for me it discredits all the other stuff you said and i just couldn't go on reading, it makes me really mad...
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2011, 03:15:27 PM »

not what i said....I think we have to understand the difference between paedophilia and common abuse, which is something else again....yes they should be removed from society at large but punishing someone criminally for their nature is clearly not a real solution.... sadly mental health and specifically high risk mental health issues are largely mistreated by society and the legal system and people are pushed into prisons simply because the governments feel that high security mental health treatment is financially unviable......no pity involved...no moral judgment involved just a proper clinical decision as to where egotistical and criminal behaviour shifts into pathalogical and medically defined behaviour.....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2011, 03:17:36 PM »

oh and you do not choose to be gay or straight any more than you choose to be ginger or green eyed or hetro...
it simply IS.....people CHOOSE to try to conform to societal norms rather than admit to who they are
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2011, 03:18:58 PM »

not what i said....I think we have to understand the difference between paedophilia and common abuse, which is something else again....yes they should be removed from society at large but punishing someone criminally for their nature is clearly not a real solution.... sadly mental health and specifically high risk mental health issues are largely mistreated by society and the legal system and people are pushed into prisons simply because the governments feel that high security mental health treatment is financially unviable......no pity involved...no moral judgment involved just a proper clinical decision as to where egotistical and criminal behaviour shifts into pathalogical and medically defined behaviour.....
Okay, I see what you're saying. We should punish them. We should try to remove them and give them proper treatment.

i'm sorry, my eyes just popped to the ''being gay is a choice'' part, and while i certainly won't kill you, for me it discredits all the other stuff you said and i just couldn't go on reading, it makes me really mad...
Okay I'm going to remove that then
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slyvia k

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2011, 03:20:26 PM »

oh and you do not choose to be gay or straight any more than you choose to be ginger or green eyed or hetro...
it simply IS.....people CHOOSE to try to conform to societal norms rather than admit to who they are
:love5:
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2011, 03:25:45 PM »

I think punishment is the wrong word.....but certainly the true paedophilliac who "loves" and is obsessively and sexually obsessed with children in an overtly sexual way, may not be able to control his or her urges any more than a sufferer of tourrettes can control their outbursts...it is a complex and morally murky situation.....one should endeavour to remove such individuals from society for their own good as much as the good of any child they may come into contact with, but one cannot really judge them for being mentally ill....However there are plenty of people who sexually or physically abuse children, not because of any paedophilliac tendency, but simply because children are easy victims....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2011, 03:27:13 PM »

being a pedophile is a mental illness, but so is being a sociopath. does that mean that someone who murders a lot of people should get treatment rather than go to prison? i think not. i think they should get both.

and as far as the being gay is a choice thing..BULLSHIT. i was actually caught totally off guard by my attraction towards girls. i had thought i was attracted to guys until i was 14. i had noticed that i really didn't have an interest anymore and it was worrying me. then i saw a pretty girl one day and was like "oh shit, i'm gay." i didn't choose it..and honestly at the time i didn't want it to be that way.
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The Angel Raliel

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2011, 03:28:05 PM »

Oh and if you believe that then explain why...do not simply edit away your opinions simply because people do not agree with them...not that i hardly ever delete anything I say, simply becauseI think people deserve to have the whole thing....the one thing in films I hate is when memory is deleted or altered...even for good
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2011, 03:41:30 PM »

I watch Law and Order: SVU all the time and I recently watched two episodes that dealt with pedophiles.

First, there was a group that was trying to get pedophilc relationships legal and they were arguing that they were being discriminated against like black people and gay people were a long time ago.  Now when I first heard that, it made me mad because those are two different things. Skin is something you can't change but being a pedophile is a sickness that causes you to think taking a child innocence is okay. A child does not understand the concepts of love and sex.

The second episode was even worse because it involved a guy who was trying to convince Stabler (one of the detectives) that the love he had for little girls was as pure as being married with an adult. It made me mad to realize that people are actually like that.

So what do you think? Lets begin the debate!

so far as i know, black people and gay people are still being discriminated against, as are jews, whites, italians....well, basically everybody.


as far as pedos go, i don't have a solid opinion.  really, the only reason i see to not cull them is that they can't control or really ever change their behavior.  from everything i have read about them, they don't respond to corrective therapy, treatment, nor threat of punishment.  to me, this says they can't change, and i am recalcitrant to condemn anyone based on something they can't control.
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The Angel Raliel

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2011, 03:49:54 PM »

indeed punitive measures against someone for their nature, wether or not that conforms to societal ideals or moral concepts rarely have any effect other than to inflict suffering upon any individual so deemed.......Understanding does not hint at agreeing or condoning a behaviour
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2011, 03:55:16 PM »

indeed punitive measures against someone for their nature, wether or not that conforms to societal ideals or moral concepts rarely have any effect other than to inflict suffering upon any individual so deemed.......Understanding does not hint at agreeing or condoning a behaviour
having empathy isn't the same as understanding, either, but having no empathy for something precludes one's ability for understanding when it is something one's nature finds abhorrent.

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Mockery

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #14 on: July 19, 2011, 03:59:28 PM »

Oh and if you believe that then explain why...do not simply edit away your opinions simply because people do not agree with them...not that i hardly ever delete anything I say, simply becauseI think people deserve to have the whole thing....the one thing in films I hate is when memory is deleted or altered...even for good

I want to explain but when I do, people put words in my mouth and then everything goes to shit.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #15 on: July 19, 2011, 04:10:25 PM »

go for it....make a good and thoughtful insight into your beliefs and have the courage of your convictions
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #16 on: July 19, 2011, 04:14:20 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #17 on: July 19, 2011, 04:28:28 PM »

not offended just think you are naive...homosexuality occurs in all sorts of nature....knew a pair of hooper Swans that happened to be male but had mated happily for life....I think that absolute belief in anything a book that has been re-edited for thousands of years to control society is a doubtful tool for any personal morality in this current age of enlightenment...question evrything and explore the truth, even if that truth is unpalatable to your own ideas.......

fancying the occasional girl is not the same thing as being homosexual (nor is feeling that one is trapped in the wrong gender)
and as it happens female homosexuality is almost the norm in nature.....plenty of species only just tolerate male interaction for the propagation of the species and some invertebrates have done away with males all together for millions of years
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #18 on: July 19, 2011, 04:42:12 PM »

Okay.

Hooray, I didn't offend anyone!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #19 on: July 19, 2011, 04:45:12 PM »

well...there are plenty of people on here somewhat less ...ummm me, than me on here...so await the storm, but yes you should question why you felt the need to remove the statement possibly even more than your reason for making it....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #20 on: July 19, 2011, 04:46:27 PM »

well...there are plenty of people on here somewhat less ...ummm me, than me on here...so await the storm, but yes you should question why you felt the need to remove the statement possibly even more than your reason for making it....

Okay. Thanks AR.

So back to the subject at hand.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #21 on: July 19, 2011, 04:49:06 PM »

indeed
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #22 on: July 19, 2011, 05:05:25 PM »

Paedos should be punished, Human Centipede style.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #23 on: July 19, 2011, 05:11:56 PM »

Being gay is not a choice -why would anyone choose to be different in such a way that ignites hatred in other people?

I don't think that it's a choice either as I couldn't "choose" it... I just don't feel anything sexual towards women, though I do recognise some women being very sexy...

Paedophiles need to be helped, though. Especially if they can't understand what they are doing wrong. Children never seek out older people and intiate sexual activity with them, so it's not consensual in any way, even if the age barrier would only be a taboo...
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #24 on: July 19, 2011, 06:08:23 PM »

it used to anger me when people wpould say homosexuality is a choice, but it's that empathy thing again.  i can't reasonably expect someone to have an educated opinion on something they don't feel, and, maybe for them, heterosexuality WAS a choice. 
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #25 on: July 19, 2011, 06:53:26 PM »

it used to anger me when people wpould say homosexuality is a choice, but it's that empathy thing again.  i can't reasonably expect someone to have an educated opinion on something they don't feel, and, maybe for them, heterosexuality WAS a choice. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJtjqLUHYoY

(how do you tag youtube links on this board, again?)
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #26 on: July 19, 2011, 06:58:42 PM »

I think I somehow lost a very long and eloquent speech from this thread....sadly I really cannot be bothered to repeat it
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #27 on: July 19, 2011, 08:26:51 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #28 on: July 19, 2011, 08:42:54 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.

So what you're saying then is that you believe gay people go against "God's design" but pedophiles don't? By your logic, God designed people to be attracted to people with which procreation is possible. Procreation is not (typically) possible with children, so how are the two scenarios any different? The only choice anyone has is whether or not to act upon their sexual desires, be those acts with members of the same sex or acts with children.

Gay people just have it easier because they're attracted to people who can consent.

I know you're not condemning gay people for choosing to act on their desires with people who have similar desires, don't get me wrong, but I think it is incredibly naive to think that we have any choice in the matter of what we're attracted to, above the choice to act on it. Additionally, if that was the case, pedophiles could simply choose to be attracted to adults, instead; a sentiment which you've already said you don't agree with.



As for the discussion on pedophilia, I do not believe that pedophiles should be criminally prosecuted unless they've acted on their desires. Once they've acted on their desires, rehabilitation should be sought but all opportunity for them to commit a repeat offence should be removed. This includes the production and consumption of child pornography, because the demand for the material is what ultimately supports the continual exploitation of children.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #29 on: July 19, 2011, 08:51:11 PM »

Being gay is not a choice -why would anyone choose to be different in such a way that ignites hatred in other people?

See, I take some measure of issue with this sentiment - I agree, it's not a choice, but I feel like it's interpreted by a vast majority of straight people as "we all want to be straight, really, we just can't make ourselves!"

I don't want to be straight. I don't want to be discriminated against, but I am happy with who I am and the life I lead and I know so many queer people who feel the same. We make the choice to act on our desires instead of practising celibacy, but if I could really, truly choose my desires, I'd choose to be queer.

I can't choose. Bottom line. But I can still love what I've been given.

(Sorry to double post)
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #30 on: July 20, 2011, 12:42:54 AM »

i agree that if a Pedophile (my computer doesnt like when i spell it with an a i guess...) acts on their impulses that they should be sent to jail or some equivalent as well as get help the same way anyone else with any sort of mental disorder who acts out on their impulses would...

but at the same time, there are still cultures out there where it is the norm to get married to and have children with young girls, so does that count as well? and if you think about it at one point in time that was the norm for most people, because you had to start having babies young cause you probably wouldn't live to 30-40...now dont get me wrong i dont personally agree with these things, but they are there...
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #31 on: July 20, 2011, 01:30:41 AM »

in the strictest sense... paedophilia is the sexual desire for opre-pubescent children....even in cultures where marriage is very young... it is generally with girls who have "reached womanhood".....other pre-pubescent marriages do occur but these are usually arranged marriages to do with land, money, etc and have usually little or nothing to do with sex.......

Also being homosexual is not the same as paedophilia as homosexuality usually has quite normal and controllable levels of sexual desire ...........where as true paedophilia is (along with other "philia") an overwhelming sexual urge triggered by children...just because one hapens to be gay does not mean that one immediately gets turned on by every one of the same gender that they encounter!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #32 on: July 20, 2011, 03:32:42 AM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman.


And I have nothing against negative nancies, but I feel like they are going against Twilight Sparkle's true quest for friendship, because Friendship is Magic.

*blinks*
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #33 on: July 20, 2011, 03:39:54 AM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.


I have to agree with what you and BB Gun have written.

And I would comment further into your opinion of Mockery and her obtuse opinions, but then that wouldn't be very Applejack of me.   :-\
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #34 on: July 20, 2011, 05:06:24 AM »

I haven't read no more than the first page but i needed to talk,

I saw a documentary about human brain. In the documentary, it was told that most of the criminal behaviours are shaped by the damaged or defective parts of the brain. But the researches about these parts were kept secret, because it would simply cause people to commit the crimes and put the blame on their damaged brains.

Since most of the damages comes from the genes and birth, then it would we impossible to judge or punish people for the crimes they commited.

I have doubts about this problem. Of course we can not judge the people suffering from heavy psychotic diseases, most of them has no connection with the reality. I know from my aunt, she is heavily sick with paranoia and schizophrenia for more than 30 years. Let me explain with an example, she may sacrifice her life for us-her nieces and nephews. But when she goes through a crysis, she may even kill us without hesitation. Once she attacked me because her imaginery friends told her my mother is evil and i'm evil's daughter. Everything has happened in a blink of eye, she took the blade from the kitchen and i saw her running towards me shouting "bitch". Luckly my uncle and cousine managed to stop her and take the blade. Long story short, i believe in the necessity of giving the medical treatment instead of putting such people to the jails.

But on the other hand, pedophilia is not a psychotic disease. It's a behavioural disorder rather than something caused by a damaged brain. Most of the people with pedophilia has total connection to the reality. As far as i know most of them are aware of the wrongfulness of the thing they desire. I think at this point, it's a matter of choice. You know, most of us have ambitions, most of us hold grudge, most of us want to kill somebody at times. For example, whenever my boss behaves in a rude way while he's telling me to do something, i close my eyes and imagine myself killing him. Later on i feel a little guilty for imagining such a horrible thing. But most of the time it helps me to get rid of my anger. As far as i know most of the people chooses to get rid of their anger this way, though some of them choose to make it for real. There's a line between doing and imagining something. And it's the power of fighting with our wills, what keeps us in the good side. Now that the pedophilia is defined as a disorder, i think they must have medical treatment. But also they must be jailed too so that they can see what happens if they listen to the voice of their wills. I think if they have medical treatment and mental healing, they even can feel the pricks of conscience, and take some lessons.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #35 on: July 20, 2011, 11:35:07 AM »

Paedos should be punished, Human Centipede style.

Normally I would say that's cruel but in the case of pedos, I'll allow it.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #36 on: July 20, 2011, 12:00:41 PM »

Really? what if you were wrong? what if the person was suffering from a particular mental disorder that was actually treatable?
a civilised world should never stoop to uncivilised methods of punishment.......
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #37 on: July 20, 2011, 12:03:37 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.


I have to agree with what you and BB Gun have written.

And I would comment further into your opinion of Mockery and her obtuse opinions, but then that wouldn't be very Applejack of me.   :-\

No that wouldn't be.

Guys, can we forget about what i said about my views since you all seem to hate them? I'd like to stick at the subject on hand please!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #38 on: July 20, 2011, 12:12:22 PM »

Really? what if you were wrong? what if the person was suffering from a particular mental disorder that was actually treatable?
a civilised world should never stoop to uncivilised methods of punishment.......

what are a civilized society's treatment methods for pedophilia?

#@!

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #39 on: July 20, 2011, 12:15:56 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.
See? See what you just did? You put words in my mouth. I never said that being gay and being a pedophile are the same thing because they are not!

I have a right to state my opinion but I don't like hurting other peoples feelings okay? And maybe I am naive but so is everyone! No one is all knowing! Do you know about everything in the world? You don't so fuck off!

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #40 on: July 20, 2011, 12:25:04 PM »

calm it kiddies.....not everyone has to share the same opinion.....and it is up to the individual to question their own opinions and honestly understand why the y think that way.......


as for the civilised worlds way of dealing with true paedophillia is probably going to have to chemical and restrictional.....the true monsters out there in humanity are much more problematic
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #41 on: July 20, 2011, 12:37:11 PM »

so a bullet to the head is out, then?  :(

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #42 on: July 20, 2011, 12:41:29 PM »

sorry yep........I am kind of hardline against any form of vengeance based legal conduct......
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #43 on: July 20, 2011, 12:42:12 PM »

Why don't all pedophiles who are convicted get therapy? Wouldn't that help?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #44 on: July 20, 2011, 12:49:38 PM »

mainly because it is far cheaper to simply lock criminals away thant to actually attempt rehabilitation or cure....
this basically leads to them either being brutalised inside or networking and learning new criminal skills.....IF paedophillia is truly a mental illness in many caes then you are essentially locking up a person with no other criminal intentions in a place where it suddenly becaomes available to learn directly from inmates loads of criminal skills.....these days even rather high tech ones....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #45 on: July 20, 2011, 01:59:44 PM »

indeed....tis a complex thing and I doubt we will ever truly understand the deeper complexities on here....after all psychologists and practicioners of law have been debating such things for a very long while without any truly satisfactory answers to this thorny problem
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #46 on: July 20, 2011, 03:37:02 PM »

The problem is distinguishing between the mental issue and sadistic fucks.  Because I'm pretty sure not all paedophiles are mentally ill (in that sense, anyway) some are just evil bastards, but then would the word paedophile fit or should there be an even worse word encompassing all of their nasty ways?


Also, Caddy, I'm really glad you are back.


Why thank you.  I was off having a life orgasm.


I wish I had more to add to this conversation, as I'm not a fan of picking apart a pedophile, but I agree that people should be rehabilitated in cases like this, instead of just left in jail to rot, or have a shot to the head.  That's not going to cure whatever mental issues they have going on to be so attracted to young children.  What should have therapy be?  Man, I don't know.  I'd have a kneejerk reaction if I knew a guy or woman that sexually molested any of my fiancee's nephews, but I can't say that these people cannot be rehabilitated.  It's just a creepy crawly situation all around.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #47 on: July 20, 2011, 03:38:04 PM »

giving them psychiatric treatment then crosses over into healthcare, and while we freely give that to prisoners, there's still some debate as to how much the state is allowed to pay to mess around in someone's mind, especially if they are not assured of results.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #48 on: July 20, 2011, 03:44:08 PM »

...people should be rehabilitated in cases like this, instead of just left in jail to rot, or have a shot to the head....
Unfortunately, study after study after study has shown with disgusting consistency that
pedophiles re-offend, no matter what sort of therapy is used, in what setting, or for how
long.  There are differences in how long it takes, and whether they progress from enticement
to violence, for example, but there's no "cure" except complete isolation from all potential
victims.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #49 on: July 20, 2011, 04:16:22 PM »

...people should be rehabilitated in cases like this, instead of just left in jail to rot, or have a shot to the head....
Unfortunately, study after study after study has shown with disgusting consistency that
pedophiles re-offend, no matter what sort of therapy is used, in what setting, or for how
long.  There are differences in how long it takes, and whether they progress from enticement
to violence, for example, but there's no "cure" except complete isolation from all potential
victims.

Or, a shot to the head, eh?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #50 on: July 20, 2011, 04:29:34 PM »

...people should be rehabilitated in cases like this, instead of just left in jail to rot, or have a shot to the head....
Unfortunately, study after study after study has shown with disgusting consistency that
pedophiles re-offend, no matter what sort of therapy is used, in what setting, or for how
long.  There are differences in how long it takes, and whether they progress from enticement
to violence, for example, but there's no "cure" except complete isolation from all potential
victims.
Or, a shot to the head, eh?
...which would serve to isolate them from potential victims, no?  Heck, I could see an argument
that it would be a mercy in some cases - but I can't think of ANYONE I'd trust to make that call.

There's no easy solution.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #51 on: July 20, 2011, 09:15:49 PM »

Guys, can we forget about what i said about my views since you all seem to hate them? I'd like to stick at the subject on hand please!

Hating your views and contesting them are two very different things. From your profile I can see that you're 22, but you (and several others, I've noticed) talk on here like you're 13 and don't understand the concept of having an adult conversation which includes debate and the expression of different points of view. Adults share and argue their opinions and are willing to consider the opinions of others who disagree with them. That is how we as people learn and grow, by being receptive and open minded and willing to admit we are fallible and not always correct.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?
See? See what you just did? You put words in my mouth. I never said that being gay and being a pedophile are the same thing because they are not!

I have a right to state my opinion but I don't like hurting other peoples feelings okay? And maybe I am naive but so is everyone! No one is all knowing! Do you know about everything in the world? You don't so fuck off!

Actually, you were putting words in her mouth. She said you compared the two, which you did. You said that she said that you said they are the same thing, which she didn't.

You have every right to express your opinion and everyone else has the right to disagree.Totalfrog's point here about learning about things you don't understand applies to things you've misunderstood. As I was saying, if you consider the arguments other users make against your opinions with an open mind and a willingness to learn, you will be the one who benefits.

Everyone is naive about certain topics, yes, but defending your naivety is like saying you want to continue being naive. When people call you out on things you don't know, try to learn from them instead of telling them to fuck off. You don't have to know everything in the world to teach someone about something you do know.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #52 on: July 21, 2011, 02:06:30 AM »

...people should be rehabilitated in cases like this, instead of just left in jail to rot, or have a shot to the head....
Unfortunately, study after study after study has shown with disgusting consistency that
pedophiles re-offend, no matter what sort of therapy is used, in what setting, or for how
long.  There are differences in how long it takes, and whether they progress from enticement
to violence, for example, but there's no "cure" except complete isolation from all potential
victims.

Hopefully, by studying them it will be possible to find a method which helps them cope. While that is happening, maybe a tight-security mental institution would be better than prison, though.

Also, if you study paedophiles maybe you can find a link so you can predict risk factors in others and prevent child abuse. Or, let the taboo dissolve a bit so that people who have these urges would come for therapy and try to prevent any abuse from happening.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #53 on: July 21, 2011, 02:19:41 AM »

indeed the stronger a society vilifies something, the more it is driven underground and becomes less manageable by society....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #54 on: July 21, 2011, 08:54:34 AM »

Hence Human Centipede. Easy to track and identify.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #55 on: July 21, 2011, 09:11:08 AM »

Hence Human Centipede. Easy to track and identify.

The government here has a resolution about the pedophiles and rapists. It's not enacted as a law yet but they're planning to emasculate them by injecting a mixture of hormones and other things.

According to the resolution, if a rapist commits the same crime for the second time after he gets out of the jail, he'll get emasculated.

And as for the pedophiles, they're thinking of getting such people through psychiatric examination, and after that if they're diagnosed with a mental illness, and unable to control themselves, they'll get emasculated and rehabilitated. But if they are able to control themselves, and committed to that crime anyway, they'll be put into jail and emasculated.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #56 on: July 21, 2011, 11:44:40 AM »

the reason this is a controversial choice is it smacks of Eugenics and  ultimately if a law allows eugenics in one occasion it allows for that law to be extended into other classes of people (like the sterilisation of Downs syndrome patients etc)
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #57 on: July 21, 2011, 01:08:38 PM »

the reason this is a controversial choice is it smacks of Eugenics and  ultimately if a law allows eugenics in one occasion it allows for that law to be extended into other classes of people (like the sterilisation of Downs syndrome patients etc)

That's why they're having difficulties in enacting it as a law. First it sounded reasonable because it's really hard to track/treat these kinda people for a lifetime. But there's no limit in solving the problem in this way. Today pedophiles, tomorrow rapists, the other day down syndrome patients, the other year colorblinds, obeses, etc. It may become a violation of human rights easily.

The thing is: educating them so that they do not to commit crimes, and healing them instead of disabling.

This resolution reminded me of a story at the first chapter of Thomas More's Utopia. Cardinal says he was surprized by the increase of the amount of robbery - though the judges condemned thieves to death by hanging. And Hythloday tells him it was not a solution, if people knew they'd get hanged but they stole anyway that's because they're hungry.

So, if pedophilie is a really serious and heavy mental disorder, they must be kept under control and treated.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #58 on: July 21, 2011, 03:31:02 PM »

i'm not entirely opposed to eugenics as a practice.  it's not a very politically correct solution, but try as i might i can't find a problem with trying to make both fewer and better humans (and i can think of quite a few that should not be allowed to breed).  of course i also see the problems inherent in trying to decide who is well-formed enough to have a life.

the problem is, like cee, i can't think of anyone i would trust to make the decisions.  however, our unchecked breeding is a huge problem no one wants to address.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #59 on: July 21, 2011, 03:38:33 PM »

oh indeed... that is the charm of eugenics and involuntary "euthanasia" ....viscerally, one can actually agree, but if one is responsible, one realises thatmuch as a good tool these  ideas can be to society as a whole....to legalise such practices makes it incredibly easy to use them as a tool for fascism without even noticing .......and truly death penalties simply do not work as a deterrent to any form of crime...the U.S. states that still use such, do not have significantly lower crime rates....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #60 on: July 21, 2011, 04:27:56 PM »

oh indeed... that is the charm of eugenics and involuntary "euthanasia" ....viscerally, one can actually agree, but if one is responsible, one realises thatmuch as a good tool these  ideas can be to society as a whole....to legalise such practices makes it incredibly easy to use them as a tool for fascism without even noticing .......and truly death penalties simply do not work as a deterrent to any form of crime...the U.S. states that still use such, do not have significantly lower crime rates....
it's rather like nuclear power, isn't it?  good when it powers everybody cheaply and cleanly, bad when it breaks or is used to erase a city.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #61 on: July 21, 2011, 04:35:24 PM »

indeed
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #62 on: July 21, 2011, 08:17:38 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.


I have to agree with what you and BB Gun have written.

And I would comment further into your opinion of Mockery and her obtuse opinions, but then that wouldn't be very Applejack of me.   :-\

No that wouldn't be.

Guys, can we forget about what i said about my views since you all seem to hate them? I'd like to stick at the subject on hand please!


I'm back less than a week, and I already have people changing their user pictures.  Damn I'm trendy.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #63 on: July 21, 2011, 08:25:25 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.


I have to agree with what you and BB Gun have written.

And I would comment further into your opinion of Mockery and her obtuse opinions, but then that wouldn't be very Applejack of me.   :-\

No that wouldn't be.

Guys, can we forget about what i said about my views since you all seem to hate them? I'd like to stick at the subject on hand please!


I'm back less than a week, and I already have people changing their user pictures.  Damn I'm trendy.
You are a trendsetter but my pumpkins are not going anywhere, I refuse to follow fashion.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #64 on: July 21, 2011, 08:27:58 PM »

But but but....PONIES!


Naw, but really I'm just a poseur.  I'm actually amazed by how many people like this new, ridiculous show.  Oh my god, if you want to have yourself a time, go look up "bronies".  It's really scary stuff.

And I guess that solidifies the fact that I'm just a troll.  :(
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #65 on: July 21, 2011, 08:35:02 PM »

But but but....PONIES!


Naw, but really I'm just a poseur.  I'm actually amazed by how many people like this new, ridiculous show.  Oh my god, if you want to have yourself a time, go look up "bronies".  It's really scary stuff.

And I guess that solidifies the fact that I'm just a troll.  :(
I am aware of bronies. I am fairly certain that brumpkins will be the next big thing.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #66 on: July 21, 2011, 08:39:39 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.


I have to agree with what you and BB Gun have written.

And I would comment further into your opinion of Mockery and her obtuse opinions, but then that wouldn't be very Applejack of me.   :-\

i'm pretty okay with mockery's opinions.  whether or not i think they are obtuse is neither here nor there, but i have posted alongside her enough to know that it doesn't come from a place of malice, nor is it my place to judge what her opinions should be.  nor is it my business to correct her, but if i were to do so, it would certainly be through as much friendliness as i could muster, since conflict, especially when personal feelings are involved, usually only serves to solidify the opinion you are contesting.  persuasion, it is to be sure, is always preferable to vilification.  and discussion is just that, discussion.

do i disagree with this one, this opinion?  sure, and quite heavily, and for complex and both subtle and obvious reasons.  but, i pretty much figure that's already obvious, since i post here a lot and my personality cant help but bombard out of every post.  it's difficult to see solidarity growing when it is set against a situation that really doesn't appear to be inflammatory, at least intentionally.  
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #67 on: July 21, 2011, 08:58:11 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.


I have to agree with what you and BB Gun have written.

And I would comment further into your opinion of Mockery and her obtuse opinions, but then that wouldn't be very Applejack of me.   :-\

i'm pretty okay with mockery's opinions.  whether or not i think they are obtuse is neither here nor there, but i have posted alongside her enough to know that it doesn't come from a place of malice, nor is it my place to judge what her opinions should be.  nor is it my business to correct her, but if i were to do so, it would certainly be through as much friendliness as i could muster, since conflict, especially when personal feelings are involved, usually only serves to solidify the opinion you are contesting.  persuasion, it is to be sure, is always preferable to vilification.  and discussion is just that, discussion.

do i disagree with this one, this opinion?  sure, and quite heavily, and for complex and both subtle and obvious reasons.  but, i pretty much figure that's already obvious, since i post here a lot and my personality cant help but bombard out of every post.  it's difficult to see solidarity growing when it is set against a situation that really doesn't appear to be inflammatory, at least intentionally. 


She thinks God made man for woman.

I think her opinions are obtuse.


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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #68 on: July 21, 2011, 09:00:11 PM »

But but but....PONIES!


Naw, but really I'm just a poseur.  I'm actually amazed by how many people like this new, ridiculous show.  Oh my god, if you want to have yourself a time, go look up "bronies".  It's really scary stuff.

And I guess that solidifies the fact that I'm just a troll.  :(
I am aware of bronies. I am fairly certain that brumpkins will be the next big thing.



I think brumpkins would be pretty rad, personally.

I would dress as one.  ESPECIALLY FOR HALLOWEEN!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #69 on: July 21, 2011, 09:12:06 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.


I have to agree with what you and BB Gun have written.

And I would comment further into your opinion of Mockery and her obtuse opinions, but then that wouldn't be very Applejack of me.   :-\

i'm pretty okay with mockery's opinions.  whether or not i think they are obtuse is neither here nor there, but i have posted alongside her enough to know that it doesn't come from a place of malice, nor is it my place to judge what her opinions should be.  nor is it my business to correct her, but if i were to do so, it would certainly be through as much friendliness as i could muster, since conflict, especially when personal feelings are involved, usually only serves to solidify the opinion you are contesting.  persuasion, it is to be sure, is always preferable to vilification.  and discussion is just that, discussion.

do i disagree with this one, this opinion?  sure, and quite heavily, and for complex and both subtle and obvious reasons.  but, i pretty much figure that's already obvious, since i post here a lot and my personality cant help but bombard out of every post.  it's difficult to see solidarity growing when it is set against a situation that really doesn't appear to be inflammatory, at least intentionally. 
I don't believe that she really believes half the stuff she posts and she sure does get a lot of attention every time she says something ridiculous. So I do believe that it is intentionally inflammatory.

I hope that it isn't. I really do. I also hope that if it isn't an act, that she learns something from the fine folks here in Box land.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #70 on: July 21, 2011, 09:18:09 PM »

Okay, here it goes.

I have nothing against gay people but I Feel like they are going against God's design because he made man for woman. In all complete honestly, there are some women I would totally fuck but I'm a girl who still need a penis.I just think it's a choice you have and if you enjoy being with someone of the same sex, go ahead! I feel all humans were born with the same sexual instinct but who knows? I could be totally wrong!

I hope I didn't offend anyone.
You are pretty offensive. I don't think it comes from a place of hate, I'll put it nicely and say it comes from naivety.

Sometimes it is better to learn about things you don't understand rather than going in and making bold faced statements like you do. You compare being gay to being a pedophile and expect no one to be offended. Then when they are you feign shock and delete your comment?

I'm starting to think you are trolling for attention. This isn't the first time you've said something ridiculous and have apparently been surprised when it caused controversy.


I have to agree with what you and BB Gun have written.

And I would comment further into your opinion of Mockery and her obtuse opinions, but then that wouldn't be very Applejack of me.   :-\

i'm pretty okay with mockery's opinions.  whether or not i think they are obtuse is neither here nor there, but i have posted alongside her enough to know that it doesn't come from a place of malice, nor is it my place to judge what her opinions should be.  nor is it my business to correct her, but if i were to do so, it would certainly be through as much friendliness as i could muster, since conflict, especially when personal feelings are involved, usually only serves to solidify the opinion you are contesting.  persuasion, it is to be sure, is always preferable to vilification.  and discussion is just that, discussion.

do i disagree with this one, this opinion?  sure, and quite heavily, and for complex and both subtle and obvious reasons.  but, i pretty much figure that's already obvious, since i post here a lot and my personality cant help but bombard out of every post.  it's difficult to see solidarity growing when it is set against a situation that really doesn't appear to be inflammatory, at least intentionally. 
I don't believe that she really believes half the stuff she posts and she sure does get a lot of attention every time she says something ridiculous. So I do believe that it is intentionally inflammatory.

I hope that it isn't. I really do. I also hope that if it isn't an act, that she learns something from the fine folks here in Box land.


See, I haven't seriously posted here in almost a year I think.  That was one of the first things I read by her when I came back.  That's what I have to go off, and I'm not going to go off how long somebody else has known them.  I'm going to go off what I have seen them say and behave.  And really, I think I was terribly lenient in saying I wouldn't say anything aside from her comments being obtuse.  I could have said a gaggle of other very mean and rude things, but I chose how I wanted to express my distaste very tactfully.  And she still gets white knighted?

Really.  White knighting is for those who deserve it, not for those who cannot accept the consequences of their actions.





And now I'm going to go watch LotR: The Two Towers.  Because I am embarrassingly behind.  :(
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #71 on: July 21, 2011, 09:22:13 PM »

@caddy:  





@totalfrog:

if mockery were trolling, she wouldn't have deleted the phrase in the first place, i feel.  plus, she is here, on the box.  so if she has a hard time unlearning whatever it is that gave her her opinion, at least she is here among we, the already damned.  which, you have to admit, is a good place to unlearn any stereotypical rhetoric, eventually.




edit, @caddy.  did you just call me a white knight?  seriously?  that's a fucking first.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #72 on: July 21, 2011, 09:26:22 PM »

Really.  White knighting is for those who deserve it, not for those who cannot accept the consequences of their actions.
I agree. And in this case I don't think she deserves it.

But this is the box Caddy my love and everyone gets white knighted by someone for reasons I have never understood. Remember people defending Alyss? And he wasn't even a subtle troll.

@totalfrog:

if mockery were trolling, she wouldn't have deleted the phrase in the first place, i feel.  plus, she is here, on the box.  so if she has a hard time unlearning whatever it is that gave her her opinion, at least she is here among we, the already damned.  which, you have to admit, is a good place to unlearn any stereotypical rhetoric, eventually.
I can see where you are coming from. This isn't the only thread she has done it in so I remain unconvinced and I stand by what I said - if I am wrong then I hope she learns something.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #73 on: July 21, 2011, 09:38:14 PM »

really not trying to white knight, to be honest.  it just bothers me when an unpopular opinion is treated as 'wrong' just because it's not the socio-acceptable one within a counterculture.  remember, more people out there than not think it IS a choice.  it's getting better, but we who love to congratulate ourselves on our open-mindedness are still in the minority in the world.  


and, it's true; being nasty about someone's opinion is the best way to solidify it.  trust me.  old people know best.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #74 on: July 22, 2011, 12:50:12 AM »

Really.  White knighting is for those who deserve it, not for those who cannot accept the consequences of their actions.
I agree. And in this case I don't think she deserves it.

But this is the box Caddy my love and everyone gets white knighted by someone for reasons I have never understood. Remember people defending Alyss? And he wasn't even a subtle troll.


Yeah, I remember that.  I even remember chatting with him, and being fooled for a quick minute.  And then I was like..ugh, no, and took off.  When I came back, it finally came out.

And now it seems that way here, with people defending trolls again.  And apparently Agonistes is bothered when an unpopular opinion is treated as wrong, because it's not accepted within a counterculture?  Isn't that counterculture this person is talking about just bustling with, umm, those within the LGBT community?  How else would somebody in that community treat it?  With respect?  With coddling?  With sugarcoating?  I'm not quite sure where they are going with this sentence.

*rubs forehead*  I can't even with this.  I abandoned the news forum I moved over to, because I needed a break from the overwhelming sadness and stress of the current news.  I figured the s.box was still lighthearted with nice people, and easy conversation.  It wasn't stressful, and didn't take a whole lot of thinking to follow the conversation.  Aaaaaaaand the first thing I come back to read is just...really uncool.  I can't even with this.  I know I'm having a bad time when I'm having to edit and re-edit my post to keep myself from saying something really, really rude.  I'm trying not to be rude, while still being very honest, and sticking to my opinion.  Which is that what was said, by said person, was obtuse.  End of story.  Beating that dead horse will not make it come back to life.  I'm trying to be very, very Applejack about this.

God, all of this, because I was congratulating somebody on validating my trendiness.  Which I am.  I am damn trendy.  Look at my pair of ponies, goddamnit.  LOOK AT THEM.
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Agonistes

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #75 on: July 22, 2011, 01:17:14 AM »

Really.  White knighting is for those who deserve it, not for those who cannot accept the consequences of their actions.
I agree. And in this case I don't think she deserves it.

But this is the box Caddy my love and everyone gets white knighted by someone for reasons I have never understood. Remember people defending Alyss? And he wasn't even a subtle troll.


Yeah, I remember that.  I even remember chatting with him, and being fooled for a quick minute.  And then I was like..ugh, no, and took off.  When I came back, it finally came out.

And now it seems that way here, with people defending trolls again.  And apparently Agonistes is bothered when an unpopular opinion is treated as wrong, because it's not accepted within a counterculture?  Isn't that counterculture this person is talking about just bustling with, umm, those within the LGBT community?  How else would somebody in that community treat it?  With respect?  With coddling?  With sugarcoating?  I'm not quite sure where they are going with this sentence.

*rubs forehead*  I can't even with this.  I abandoned the news forum I moved over to, because I needed a break from the overwhelming sadness and stress of the current news.  I figured the s.box was still lighthearted with nice people, and easy conversation.  It wasn't stressful, and didn't take a whole lot of thinking to follow the conversation.  Aaaaaaaand the first thing I come back to read is just...really uncool.  I can't even with this.  I know I'm having a bad time when I'm having to edit and re-edit my post to keep myself from saying something really, really rude.  I'm trying not to be rude, while still being very honest, and sticking to my opinion.  Which is that what was said, by said person, was obtuse.  End of story.  Beating that dead horse will not make it come back to life.  I'm trying to be very, very Applejack about this.

God, all of this, because I was congratulating somebody on validating my trendiness.  Which I am.  I am damn trendy.  Look at my pair of ponies, goddamnit.  LOOK AT THEM.

uh, of course i'm bothered when an unpopular opinion is treated as wrong.  for more than one reason, too, and not just the way the opinion was being treated; the poster as well.  at least three people had had their say about what mockery had said, and she'd even tried to withdraw it, but we didn't let her, and she was even told it was okay to share what she had to say without rancor.  in other words, i am not the one who beat the dead horse, and i'm not singling out anyone in particular about it, either, i just happened to quote your post cause the tunnel ended there.  in my case, it's just that this is the first time on this particular board this issue has actually come up, since most everyone is always of a similar opinion on the stuff that could fall under the jargon of political correctness (except me, it would seem).  it's come up from someone relatively young, and for all the hell we know it could be something that hasn't had time to form into actual thought yet, but instead is an as yet unformed thought still parroting of the parents or schoolteachers, or whatever.


for that matter, my opinions on eugenics are pretty damn abhorrent if taken to an ideal/extreme, but nobody fussed about that.  mockery basically expressed a religious sentiment.  and, frankly, i have a BIG problem with someone telling someone directly their conviction is bullshit.  say what you like about what you believe, or engage in cohesive (and mutual) debate, but when it comes to what someone else actually believes, they shouldn't be made to feel bad for expressing it.  especially when they did so to explain.  when asked.

also, what people are defending which trolls?  there are trolls in this thread?  are you seriously suggesting mockery is the social equivalent of alyss?  because i don't see that at all.
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Savannah

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #76 on: July 22, 2011, 01:49:41 AM »

uh, of course i'm bothered when an unpopular opinion is treated as wrong.  for more than one reason, too, and not just the way the opinion was being treated; the poster as well.  at least three people had had their say about what mockery had said, and she'd even tried to withdraw it, but we didn't let her, and she was even told it was okay to share what she had to say without rancor.  in other words, i am not the one who beat the dead horse.  in my case, it's just that this is the first time on this particular board this issue has actually come up, since most everyone is always of a similar opinion on the stuff that could fall under the jargon of political correctness (except me, it would seem).  it's come up from someone relatively young, and for all the hell you know it could be something that hasn't had time to form into actual thought yet, but instead is parroting of the parents or schoolteachers, or whatever.


for that matter, my opinions on eugenics is pretty damn abhorrent if taken to an ideal/extreme, but nobody fussed about that.  mockery basically expressed a religious sentiment.  and, frankly, i have a BIG problem with someone telling someone directly their conviction is bullshit.  say what you like about what you believe, or engage  in cohesive (and mutual) debate, but when it comes to what someone else actually believes, they shouldn't be made to feel bad for expressing it.  especially when they did so to explain.  when asked.

also, what people are defending which trolls?  there are trolls in this thread?  are you seriously suggesting mockery is the social equivalent of alyss?  because i don't see that at all.

^Agreed.

And this is a grey matter, as you can also see the section the thread was started in. There's no law about it, there's no completely right or wrong. I think it's unnecessary to degrade people just because they've spoken their minds, if we really have to fight with something it must be the thoughts instead of people.

I completely disagree with Mockery but it doesn't make her a troll. If you ask about the matter to the people from the previous generation, most of them will give the same answer as she did. This is kinda dogmatic. If there are some people who still say "God created man for women", it's not because they're troll or evil or judgemental. It's because they are being educated in this way, they've born into this mentality. And if we keep on degrading these kind of people because of what they think, they'll never have the chance to talk about it.

Bias and dogmas can only be destroyed by looking at the subject from many different point of views. If the person is unable to do that, you may show how it seems like from your side and give them an idea.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #77 on: July 22, 2011, 02:09:01 AM »

Guys, arguing against someone's opinion is not degrading it.

Since when was it not okay for people to express their disagreement on the shadowbox?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #78 on: July 22, 2011, 02:13:15 AM »

uh, of course i'm bothered when an unpopular opinion is treated as wrong.  for more than one reason, too, and not just the way the opinion was being treated; the poster as well.  at least three people had had their say about what mockery had said, and she'd even tried to withdraw it, but we didn't let her, and she was even told it was okay to share what she had to say without rancor.  in other words, i am not the one who beat the dead horse.  in my case, it's just that this is the first time on this particular board this issue has actually come up, since most everyone is always of a similar opinion on the stuff that could fall under the jargon of political correctness (except me, it would seem).  it's come up from someone relatively young, and for all the hell you know it could be something that hasn't had time to form into actual thought yet, but instead is parroting of the parents or schoolteachers, or whatever.


for that matter, my opinions on eugenics is pretty damn abhorrent if taken to an ideal/extreme, but nobody fussed about that.  mockery basically expressed a religious sentiment.  and, frankly, i have a BIG problem with someone telling someone directly their conviction is bullshit.  say what you like about what you believe, or engage  in cohesive (and mutual) debate, but when it comes to what someone else actually believes, they shouldn't be made to feel bad for expressing it.  especially when they did so to explain.  when asked.

also, what people are defending which trolls?  there are trolls in this thread?  are you seriously suggesting mockery is the social equivalent of alyss?  because i don't see that at all.

^Agreed.

And this is a grey matter, as you can also see the section the thread was started in. There's no law about it, there's no completely right or wrong. I think it's unnecessary to degrade people just because they've spoken their minds, if we really have to fight with something it must be the thoughts instead of people.

I completely disagree with Mockery but it doesn't make her a troll. If you ask about the matter to the people from the previous generation, most of them will give the same answer as she did. This is kinda dogmatic. If there are some people who still say "God created man for women", it's not because they're troll or evil or judgemental. It's because they are being educated in this way, they've born into this mentality. And if we keep on degrading these kind of people because of what they think, they'll never have the chance to talk about it.

Bias and dogmas can only be destroyed by looking at the subject from many different point of views. If the person is unable to do that, you may show how it seems like from your side and give them an idea.
My opinion is based on a number of threads. Not just this one. And like I keep repeating, if I am wrong I hope she is learning that there is a different world view to her own.

also, what people are defending which trolls?  there are trolls in this thread?  are you seriously suggesting mockery is the social equivalent of alyss?  because i don't see that at all.
She's not. Alyss was a completely different kettle of fish, he was possibly the world's biggest pain in the arse but some people here still white knighted him. This is the one of the few forums on the internet where someone will defend you no matter how insane the point you are trying to make. It happened before Alyss and it will continue. It is just the way the box is.


And Caddy darling you only have one pony. Not ponies plural. I think one may have up and run away. Also, you haven't dropped a serious Caddybomb yet. I am impressed.

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #79 on: July 22, 2011, 02:17:59 AM »

Guys, arguing against someone's opinion is not degrading it.

Since when was it not okay for people to express their disagreement on the shadowbox?


Since the time it's been ok to call people trolls just because you disagree with them.

I didn't mean to say something like "we should not disagree, we should not discuss" i meant to say, we should not judge or insult people because we disagree with what they're thinking.

Disagreement is one thing, judging is totally another thing.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #80 on: July 22, 2011, 02:38:53 AM »

Guys, arguing against someone's opinion is not degrading it.

Since when was it not okay for people to express their disagreement on the shadowbox?


Since the time it's been ok to call people trolls just because you disagree with them.

I didn't mean to say something like "we should not disagree, we should not discuss" i meant to say, we should not judge or insult people because we disagree with what they're thinking.

Disagreement is one thing, judging is totally another thing.

I believe totalfrog expressed her opinion that she was beginning to think Mockery might be a troll.

Froggie isn't basing this opinion on this one comment. As she mentioned in her most recent post, this is based on many posts in many threads. I personally have a hard time believing that a troll would create as much of a persona as Mockery has, but I can understand where totalfrog is coming from. Mockery makes some of the most misogynistic, sexist, anti-feminist, homophobic, fatphobic, slut-shaming, ignorant comments I've ever seen on this board. I am willing to believe it is because she is naive, but she keeps getting offended when people disagree with her and saying that we all just "hate [her]" for disagreeing, like she doesn't want to learn any better.

Does that sound like youtube comments to anyone else?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #81 on: July 22, 2011, 02:47:59 AM »

actually it sounds like someone who has had a rather more mainstream/religious/conformist background than the majority of us freakies! and I think it was clearly pointed out quite early that people strongly did not agree with her statements, but that did not mean that we would attack her......and then we attacked....If we are to be open minded and good people, we should behave as such especially when confronted with statements based in ignorance.....educate! do not inflamate! (just made that word up, but i like it)
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #82 on: July 22, 2011, 02:50:03 AM »

uh, of course i'm bothered when an unpopular opinion is treated as wrong.  for more than one reason, too, and not just the way the opinion was being treated; the poster as well.  at least three people had had their say about what mockery had said, and she'd even tried to withdraw it, but we didn't let her, and she was even told it was okay to share what she had to say without rancor.  in other words, i am not the one who beat the dead horse.  in my case, it's just that this is the first time on this particular board this issue has actually come up, since most everyone is always of a similar opinion on the stuff that could fall under the jargon of political correctness (except me, it would seem).  it's come up from someone relatively young, and for all the hell you know it could be something that hasn't had time to form into actual thought yet, but instead is parroting of the parents or schoolteachers, or whatever.


for that matter, my opinions on eugenics is pretty damn abhorrent if taken to an ideal/extreme, but nobody fussed about that.  mockery basically expressed a religious sentiment.  and, frankly, i have a BIG problem with someone telling someone directly their conviction is bullshit.  say what you like about what you believe, or engage  in cohesive (and mutual) debate, but when it comes to what someone else actually believes, they shouldn't be made to feel bad for expressing it.  especially when they did so to explain.  when asked.

also, what people are defending which trolls?  there are trolls in this thread?  are you seriously suggesting mockery is the social equivalent of alyss?  because i don't see that at all.

^Agreed.

And this is a grey matter, as you can also see the section the thread was started in. There's no law about it, there's no completely right or wrong. I think it's unnecessary to degrade people just because they've spoken their minds, if we really have to fight with something it must be the thoughts instead of people.

I completely disagree with Mockery but it doesn't make her a troll. If you ask about the matter to the people from the previous generation, most of them will give the same answer as she did. This is kinda dogmatic. If there are some people who still say "God created man for women", it's not because they're troll or evil or judgemental. It's because they are being educated in this way, they've born into this mentality. And if we keep on degrading these kind of people because of what they think, they'll never have the chance to talk about it.

Bias and dogmas can only be destroyed by looking at the subject from many different point of views. If the person is unable to do that, you may show how it seems like from your side and give them an idea.


You're right, she's not a troll.  At least Alyss was kind of fun to hang around while he was here.  I mean, until he was revealed to be a stupid troll and all.  Actually, I think Alyss was the last, most interesting thing that happened to this board, which is probably why I never post here.

Aside from that, Mockery's religious opinion was obtuse.  To say that doesn't degrade her.  I did not say Mockery was obtuse.  I said her opinion, born from her religious beliefs, is very and extremely obtuse.  So no, Agonistes, nobody is telling her she cannot express her religious convictions.  I'm just telling her that they are, in fact, obtuse.  I don't know why that is so goddamn hard to understand.  I swear to god you guys really think she is getting the third degree.  Oh god, you should drop her in the middle of this place circa 2006, and see what some of those people would have done to her.  I'm seriously being as kind as I possibly can with my opinion about what she said.

Wow, I didn't waste any time in the few days I've posted here again, have I?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #83 on: July 22, 2011, 02:51:30 AM »

indeed.... but we kind of had this discussion already....why are we doing it again?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #84 on: July 22, 2011, 02:57:35 AM »

We didn't have a discussion. Some of us spoke up to disagree and we were told that isn't okay, so we're fighting back.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #85 on: July 22, 2011, 02:58:45 AM »

actually it sounds like someone who has had a rather more mainstream/religious/conformist background than the majority of us freakies! and I think it was clearly pointed out quite early that people strongly did not agree with her statements, but that did not mean that we would attack her......and then we attacked....If we are to be open minded and good people, we should behave as such especially when confronted with statements based in ignorance.....educate! do not inflamate! (just made that word up, but i like it)


Aw, dude.  I'm not in the business of educating anymore.  Actually, I would be happy to change my opinion of her being obtuse, if she were here, in the thick of this, arguing for herself.  As it stands, she's getting white knighted, which isn't helping to fix any of her muddled beliefs, either.  Mockery should be here saying all of this.  You say she's young, but I call bullshit.  When I was 22-years-old, I had all of my beliefs in order, and if I didn't I had to fight them out myself.  This is like arguing with the fence she's built up around herself, and it's not cool.



Guys, arguing against someone's opinion is not degrading it.

Since when was it not okay for people to express their disagreement on the shadowbox?


Since the time it's been ok to call people trolls just because you disagree with them.

I didn't mean to say something like "we should not disagree, we should not discuss" i meant to say, we should not judge or insult people because we disagree with what they're thinking.

Disagreement is one thing, judging is totally another thing.

I believe totalfrog expressed her opinion that she was beginning to think Mockery might be a troll.

Froggie isn't basing this opinion on this one comment. As she mentioned in her most recent post, this is based on many posts in many threads. I personally have a hard time believing that a troll would create as much of a persona as Mockery has, but I can understand where totalfrog is coming from. Mockery makes some of the most misogynistic, sexist, anti-feminist, homophobic, fatphobic, slut-shaming, ignorant comments I've ever seen on this board. I am willing to believe it is because she is naive, but she keeps getting offended when people disagree with her and saying that we all just "hate [her]" for disagreeing, like she doesn't want to learn any better.

Does that sound like youtube comments to anyone else?

Are you serious?  She's said all of these things, and people are coddling her?  And then getting angry with those who do not like these comments, and are confronting her head on?  Wow, this is nothing more than a bunch of bullshit.  I understand not outright flaming somebody, because they're young and ignorant, but she's 22-years-old.  She's not 15-years-old.  She's got access to more information out there than any generation before her.  It's there.  Age is not an excuse, and that's really more patronizing and ageist to say that she's just young and stupid, instead of saying that she has very problematic ideas and opinions, and they need to be called out.  
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #86 on: July 22, 2011, 02:59:34 AM »

no one said you should not disagree... I pointed out that going on a character rampage was not really the best way of going about things and encouraged discussion and explanation
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #87 on: July 22, 2011, 03:00:23 AM »

indeed.... but we kind of had this discussion already....why are we doing it again?


We're having it again, because I responded to her post about it, because she changed it to a My Little Pony, that's why.




So yes, Froggie!  I do have two ponies!  One of them is just on somebody else's profile.  Actually, I thought it was kinda cool that she changed to a MLP picture.  :(
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #88 on: July 22, 2011, 03:01:22 AM »

no one said you should not disagree... I pointed out that going on a character rampage was not really the best way of going about things and encouraged discussion and explanation


Oh my god.  Who is going on a character rampage?  Nobody is rampaging her character here.  People are, in fact pointing out things THE POSTER HERSELF has said.  If that is going on a character rampage, then oh boy that just proves there's an issue here.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #89 on: July 22, 2011, 03:02:40 AM »

the idea do indeed need to be challenged and a long explanation as to WHY the comment was obtuse, offensive, naive, bigoted etc...I found the comment offensive, but I do not find the person offensive, just misguided....do not want this place to become a forum with only one mindset do we?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #90 on: July 22, 2011, 03:03:39 AM »

indeed did not say anyone was doing that but basically the hijacking of this thread again simply to discuss this is kind of basically doing that in itself....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #91 on: July 22, 2011, 03:05:04 AM »

warning against a character rampage is not the same as suggesting one had happened or was under way....gosh you lot are always so feisty! deeep breaths and relax......
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #92 on: July 22, 2011, 03:06:28 AM »

indeed.... but we kind of had this discussion already....why are we doing it again?

because nothing exciting has happened since Alyss...

Also I don't think Mockery is a pretend character. I just think she's an immature kid who likes attention. Now that she has had a couple of pages devoted to her perceived ignorance we probably should just move on.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #93 on: July 22, 2011, 03:09:23 AM »

I don't know Mockery, i have never met her. I just know her as much as she has written here.

Especially from what she said on SlutWalks thread, i got very nervous last week and not just to her but also to the people who shared the same idea. People tried to speak opinions, argued with them, but eventually it has become a chaos because one of our friends unintentially insulted them. It got a little bit chaotic until she asked for an apology.
Things just calmed down, didn't get solved.

And i didn't even bother speaking my mind because they seemed quite hidebound to their opinions.

But such kind of probability of her being troll has never came to my mind. Such people do not surprize me with their thousand years old thoughts probably because i live in an Eastern country and people mostly think like that. So i was just trying to emphatize with the both sides.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #94 on: July 22, 2011, 03:09:49 AM »

the idea do indeed need to be challenged and a long explanation as to WHY the comment was obtuse, offensive, naive, bigoted etc...I found the comment offensive, but I do not find the person offensive, just misguided....do not want this place to become a forum with only one mindset do we?

Point out and quote where somebody directly insulted Mockery, please.  Because it keeps being bought up that they people who disagree with her are insulting her personally, and not just calling her out of the things she has said.  So please do post these tidbits.


Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #95 on: July 22, 2011, 03:12:07 AM »

indeed.... but we kind of had this discussion already....why are we doing it again?

because nothing exciting has happened since Alyss...

Also I don't think Mockery is a pretend character. I just think she's an immature kid who likes attention. Now that she has had a couple of pages devoted to her perceived ignorance we probably should just move on.


Pah.  *sighs*  It is getting late, but I was serious about my comment.  Nobody here personally called her anything worse than behaving like a troll.  So to continue saying that we degraded her or anything like that is just really reaching for straws.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #96 on: July 22, 2011, 03:13:46 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #97 on: July 22, 2011, 03:14:35 AM »

no idea.....but if that is true...why the hijack....I really thought we had got this thread back on track...(in an OMG we are actually about to condone eugenics sort of way)
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #98 on: July 22, 2011, 03:16:18 AM »

Nah, dude.  I'm not about eugenics.  Actually, I have to say I didn't even read that part of the thread.  *hmmm*  But anybody condoning it can gtfo the planet, lol.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #99 on: July 22, 2011, 03:16:55 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #100 on: July 22, 2011, 03:17:14 AM »

LMFAO @Oprah.

Caddy's right, no one has called her names (outside of troll). No one has really flamed her at all. A few years ago she would have been destroyed around these parts. Sure some bleeding hearts would have defended her right to say what she likes (and yes she does have that right) but there would have been people who would have taken it personally and attacked. That has not happened.

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #101 on: July 22, 2011, 03:18:16 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #102 on: July 22, 2011, 03:19:58 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #103 on: July 22, 2011, 03:21:26 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...

Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:

edit: If this were on Twitter, I'd Retweet it.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #104 on: July 22, 2011, 03:23:41 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...

Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:
I want to see an Oprah gif with that as the tagline.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #105 on: July 22, 2011, 03:24:13 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...

Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:
I want to see an Oprah gif with that as the tagline.

I like where this is going.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #106 on: July 22, 2011, 03:26:27 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...

Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:
I want to see an Oprah gif with that as the tagline.

I like where this is going.

I don't. I'm calling cissexism. Genitals are not the same as gender.

ETA: cissexism is kinda like transphobia, just to clarify terminology.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #107 on: July 22, 2011, 03:29:06 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...

Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:
I want to see an Oprah gif with that as the tagline.

I like where this is going.

I don't. I'm calling cissexism. Genitals are not the same as gender.

ETA: cissexism is kinda like transphobia, just to clarify terminology.

Wow the tension is still so high  ;D I thought that was just a saying. I'd totally call her uncle if she'd like me to, so no need to get balls  ;D
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #108 on: July 22, 2011, 03:31:33 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...

Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:
I want to see an Oprah gif with that as the tagline.

I like where this is going.

I don't. I'm calling cissexism. Genitals are not the same as gender.

ETA: cissexism is kinda like transphobia, just to clarify terminology.
We shall add a disclaimer. Her aunt identifies as a man, testicles are the final piece of the puzzle for him, he gets them and feels his gender identity is truly complete. Now he really does feel like he is Savannah's uncle.

Phew. Problem solved.  O0

Edit - Yes I know this is wrong. It's a backstory for an Oprah gif not a true representation of a person who identifies as trans. I could try harder but I am too effing tired. Sorry xx
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #109 on: July 22, 2011, 03:32:55 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...

Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:
I want to see an Oprah gif with that as the tagline.

I like where this is going.

I don't. I'm calling cissexism. Genitals are not the same as gender.

ETA: cissexism is kinda like transphobia, just to clarify terminology.

I thought it was, like, a quote from a movie.  Was she calling Oprah a man?  *blinks*
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #110 on: July 22, 2011, 03:34:37 AM »

We shall add a disclaimer. Her aunt identifies as a man, testicles are the final piece of the puzzle for her, she gets them and feels her gender identity is truly complete. Now she really does feel like she is Savannah's uncle.

Phew. Problem solved.  O0
It's not high tension, I am just not afraid to call people out on their oppressive commentary. Most people don't realize there's anything wrong with it, and I don't blame them. My aim is purely to educate, no hard feelings.

Also, trans* people feel like the gender they identify as regardless of the stage in their transition, and it is offensive to imply that receiving testicles is what allows a trans* person to "really" feel like their identified gender.

(Aaaaand I think I just outed myself as a trans activist and ally)

ETA: it is also disrespectful to address the theoretical uncle with female pronouns after establishing that he identifies as male
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #111 on: July 22, 2011, 03:39:48 AM »

Also yes, the thread has been hijacked.



QFT

Sometimes shit needs to be dealt with where it's happening.

If this were FB, I would Like This.

If this were tumblr, I'd heart it then reblog it with the caption "I NEED THIS ON MY DASH."
If this was on google+ I'd totally +1 it...

Sorry, had a Len moment...

Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:
I want to see an Oprah gif with that as the tagline.

I like where this is going.

I don't. I'm calling cissexism. Genitals are not the same as gender.

ETA: cissexism is kinda like transphobia, just to clarify terminology.

I thought it was, like, a quote from a movie.  Was she calling Oprah a man?  *blinks*

I don't even care who or what is Oprah  ;D

Ellen Degeneres is boradcasted here where i live but i only see Oprah on these gifs. Ellen rules!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #112 on: July 22, 2011, 03:41:14 AM »

We shall add a disclaimer. Her aunt identifies as a man, testicles are the final piece of the puzzle for her, she gets them and feels her gender identity is truly complete. Now she really does feel like she is Savannah's uncle.

Phew. Problem solved.  O0
It's not high tension, I am just not afraid to call people out on their oppressive commentary. Most people don't realize there's anything wrong with it, and I don't blame them. My aim is purely to educate, no hard feelings.

Also, trans* people feel like the gender they identify as regardless of the stage in their transition, and it is offensive to imply that receiving testicles is what allows a trans* person to "really" feel like their identified gender.

(Aaaaand I think I just outed myself as a trans activist and ally)

ETA: it is also disrespectful to address the theoretical uncle with female pronouns after establishing that he identifies as male
I totally caught that before you posted. And I edited...

Also I am tired and I was being a smartass.

Being an activist is a good thing and you do it well, your insight and comments are welcome.

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #113 on: July 22, 2011, 03:44:49 AM »

We shall add a disclaimer. Her aunt identifies as a man, testicles are the final piece of the puzzle for her, she gets them and feels her gender identity is truly complete. Now she really does feel like she is Savannah's uncle.

Phew. Problem solved.  O0
It's not high tension, I am just not afraid to call people out on their oppressive commentary. Most people don't realize there's anything wrong with it, and I don't blame them. My aim is purely to educate, no hard feelings.

Also, trans* people feel like the gender they identify as regardless of the stage in their transition, and it is offensive to imply that receiving testicles is what allows a trans* person to "really" feel like their identified gender.

(Aaaaand I think I just outed myself as a trans activist and ally)

ETA: it is also disrespectful to address the theoretical uncle with female pronouns after establishing that he identifies as male

Can't disagree with that, now can I?

And nobody is going to come down on you for being a trans activist or ally.  I think that's pretty cool, actually.

Also, consider me educated.  (ETA:  I just deleted what was just here, because I'm really talking from an overtired POV right now).  Oy.  Anyway, it's nice to see more activists and allies around.  And since I'm familiar with all the other things, but not cisgendered and sexism stuff, I could use the education.  That's a new term for me.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #114 on: July 22, 2011, 03:46:48 AM »

We shall add a disclaimer. Her aunt identifies as a man, testicles are the final piece of the puzzle for her, she gets them and feels her gender identity is truly complete. Now she really does feel like she is Savannah's uncle.

Phew. Problem solved.  O0
It's not high tension, I am just not afraid to call people out on their oppressive commentary. Most people don't realize there's anything wrong with it, and I don't blame them. My aim is purely to educate, no hard feelings.

Also, trans* people feel like the gender they identify as regardless of the stage in their transition, and it is offensive to imply that receiving testicles is what allows a trans* person to "really" feel like their identified gender.

(Aaaaand I think I just outed myself as a trans activist and ally)

ETA: it is also disrespectful to address the theoretical uncle with female pronouns after establishing that he identifies as male
I totally caught that before you posted. And I edited...

i'm not even a native english speaker. there are really few sayings in my vocabulary knowledge.

and i'm sure you also know i'm not some kind of bigot to use a saying just to offend trans people.

i do respect them, and am really sorry for they have to struggle with common people's bias. not only the bias, most of them also have to struggle to find a job, get an apartment, communicating with their families, etc. which is very sad to see in 2000s so called modern world.

ps: i'm really sorry if i offended somebody unintentionally.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #115 on: July 22, 2011, 03:50:14 AM »

We shall add a disclaimer. Her aunt identifies as a man, testicles are the final piece of the puzzle for her, she gets them and feels her gender identity is truly complete. Now she really does feel like she is Savannah's uncle.

Phew. Problem solved.  O0
It's not high tension, I am just not afraid to call people out on their oppressive commentary. Most people don't realize there's anything wrong with it, and I don't blame them. My aim is purely to educate, no hard feelings.

Also, trans* people feel like the gender they identify as regardless of the stage in their transition, and it is offensive to imply that receiving testicles is what allows a trans* person to "really" feel like their identified gender.

(Aaaaand I think I just outed myself as a trans activist and ally)

ETA: it is also disrespectful to address the theoretical uncle with female pronouns after establishing that he identifies as male
I totally caught that before you posted. And I edited...

i'm not even a native english speaker. there are really few sayings in my vocabulary knowledge.

and i'm sure you also know i'm not some kind of bigot to use a saying just to offend trans people.

i do respect them, and am really sorry for they have to struggle with common people's bias. not only the bias, most of them also have to struggle to find a job, get an apartment, communicating with their families, etc. which is very sad to see in 2000s so called modern world.

I get that. I don't think you were trying to upset anyone, I just wanted you to know that what you said could be upsetting so maybe you would think differently about saying it in the future.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #116 on: July 22, 2011, 11:28:57 AM »

good god, since when did oprah have anything to do with any of this?  oh wait....beating a dead horse.  i get it.  but, none of you guys will ever be as good as oprah at that.  she is queen of dead-horse beating.

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #117 on: July 22, 2011, 12:08:30 PM »

good god, since when did oprah have anything to do with any of this?  oh wait....beating a dead horse.  i get it.  but, none of you guys will ever be as good as oprah at that.  she is queen of dead-horse beating.


I've heard there's a video. Who knew Oprah was into that sort of thing?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #118 on: July 22, 2011, 12:18:12 PM »

good god, since when did oprah have anything to do with any of this?  oh wait....beating a dead horse.  i get it.  but, none of you guys will ever be as good as oprah at that.  she is queen of dead-horse beating.


I've heard there's a video. Who knew Oprah was into that sort of thing?
it's a rumor that she's in it, though.  she actually paid a filipino pawnshop broker to film it and the horse was SO fake.  they then moved the whole project to madrid, where they brought in all kinds of CGI and wire stunt guys, and the last i heard it was expected to be the sleeper hit of this fall.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #119 on: July 22, 2011, 12:46:38 PM »

"activism" gets used as an excuse too often these days to dictate to people how they should think by taking away the very thing that sets us apart from the rest of the animal kingdom; out language.

Instead of understanding it was a slip of the tongue from someone who as admittedly tired, you chastise them on their choice of words.

This offends me. I'm not asking you to knock it off, stop, or change what you're doing. I just ask that you be a bit more aware of the circumstances before you deign yourself fit to judge what someone's intentions are.

If my stance offends you, you'll just have to be content with being offended.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #120 on: July 22, 2011, 01:19:59 PM »

from wikipedia:

In April 1996, Buijs said in a Usenet posting, "As for the origin, I just made it up. I just kept running into the problem of what to call non-trans people in various discussions, and one day it just hit me: non-trans equals cis. Therefore, cisgendered."[6]


further:

The term has more recently been used in publications, such as a 2006 article in the Journal of Lesbian Studies[8] and Julia Serano's 2007 book Whipping Girl.[9] Serano also uses the related terms cissexual, which she defines as "people who are not transsexual and who have only ever experienced their subconscious and physical sexes as being aligned" (p. 12), and cissexism, "which is the belief that transsexuals' identified genders are inferior to, or less authentic than, those of cissexuals."[10]





so, basically, a made-up word to make sure that people who don't have issues with gender identity are defined as separate and non-empathetic to those who do.



edit:  also, joking about something does not automatically mean one is implying that it is inferior, or less authentic than the so-called 'norm' one is using as a clarifier in the fucking joke.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #121 on: July 22, 2011, 03:07:41 PM »

i'm not even a native english speaker. there are really few sayings in my vocabulary knowledge.

and i'm sure you also know i'm not some kind of bigot to use a saying just to offend trans people.

i do respect them, and am really sorry for they have to struggle with common people's bias. not only the bias, most of them also have to struggle to find a job, get an apartment, communicating with their families, etc. which is very sad to see in 2000s so called modern world.

ps: i'm really sorry if i offended somebody unintentionally.


I am not a native English speaker too, but we have similar saying here, so I got what you mean.

I don't. I'm calling cissexism. Genitals are not the same as gender.

ETA: cissexism is kinda like transphobia, just to clarify terminology.

BB Gun-it, when Savannah said:


Yeah, yeah, if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle  ;D :buck2:


She meant: "if my aunt was born a man".


"activism" gets used as an excuse too often these days to dictate to people how they should think by taking away the very thing that sets us apart from the rest of the animal kingdom; out language.

Instead of understanding it was a slip of the tongue from someone who as admittedly tired, you chastise them on their choice of words.

This offends me. I'm not asking you to knock it off, stop, or change what you're doing. I just ask that you be a bit more aware of the circumstances before you deign yourself fit to judge what someone's intentions are.

If my stance offends you, you'll just have to be content with being offended.



Remember me of paying you a beer or any drink that you might like if we met someday.
 
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #122 on: July 22, 2011, 03:14:18 PM »

"activism" gets used as an excuse too often these days to dictate to people how they should think by taking away the very thing that sets us apart from the rest of the animal kingdom; out language.

Instead of understanding it was a slip of the tongue from someone who as admittedly tired, you chastise them on their choice of words.

This offends me. I'm not asking you to knock it off, stop, or change what you're doing. I just ask that you be a bit more aware of the circumstances before you deign yourself fit to judge what someone's intentions are.

If my stance offends you, you'll just have to be content with being offended.

I haven't judged anyone's intentions. I don't know what words the ones I type look like to you, but I haven't chastised. I've made it extremely clear that I'm trying to inform people and giving them the benefit of the doubt. Not everyone knows, is friends with, loves and sleeps with trans* people. Not everyone is heavily involved in trans* activism and trans* rights movements. I don't expect everyone to know or understand what I do, but I want more than anything for people I respect to be willing to learn. And totalfrog is. And Savannah seems to be. And I don't understand why, in this community of people who've been hurt and shafted and treated as freaks and abused so many of you aren't willing to just try to learn how to stop making other people feel the way you've been made to feel.

If a tired person's automatic instinct is to refer to a trans* person by their assigned pronouns instead of their preferred pronouns, I'm going to call them out as wrong so maybe one day their automatic instinct will be to refer to trans* people by their preferred pronouns.

from wikipedia:

In April 1996, Buijs said in a Usenet posting, "As for the origin, I just made it up. I just kept running into the problem of what to call non-trans people in various discussions, and one day it just hit me: non-trans equals cis. Therefore, cisgendered."[6]


further:

The term has more recently been used in publications, such as a 2006 article in the Journal of Lesbian Studies[8] and Julia Serano's 2007 book Whipping Girl.[9] Serano also uses the related terms cissexual, which she defines as "people who are not transsexual and who have only ever experienced their subconscious and physical sexes as being aligned" (p. 12), and cissexism, "which is the belief that transsexuals' identified genders are inferior to, or less authentic than, those of cissexuals."[10]





so, basically, a made-up word to make sure that people who don't have issues with gender identity are defined as separate and non-empathetic to those who do.



edit:  also, joking about something does not automatically mean one is implying that it is inferior, or less authentic than the so-called 'norm' one is using as a clarifier in the fucking joke.

Hey guess what? Somebody at some point "made-up" every single word we use in this whole fucking language.

As knowledge and understanding progress, so must language. Having a word for people who are not transgendered is necessary, because every other possible option diminishes trans people and genderqueer people as people whose gender identities are legitimate. We use words to define things, including the difference between people who ascribe to the gender assigned to them at birth and people who don't.

Do you think rape jokes are acceptable?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #123 on: July 22, 2011, 03:42:05 PM »



from wikipedia:

In April 1996, Buijs said in a Usenet posting, "As for the origin, I just made it up. I just kept running into the problem of what to call non-trans people in various discussions, and one day it just hit me: non-trans equals cis. Therefore, cisgendered."[6]


further:

The term has more recently been used in publications, such as a 2006 article in the Journal of Lesbian Studies[8] and Julia Serano's 2007 book Whipping Girl.[9] Serano also uses the related terms cissexual, which she defines as "people who are not transsexual and who have only ever experienced their subconscious and physical sexes as being aligned" (p. 12), and cissexism, "which is the belief that transsexuals' identified genders are inferior to, or less authentic than, those of cissexuals."[10]





so, basically, a made-up word to make sure that people who don't have issues with gender identity are defined as separate and non-empathetic to those who do.



edit:  also, joking about something does not automatically mean one is implying that it is inferior, or less authentic than the so-called 'norm' one is using as a clarifier in the fucking joke.

Hey guess what? Somebody at some point "made-up" every single word we use in this whole fucking language.

As knowledge and understanding progress, so must language. Having a word for people who are not transgendered is necessary, because every other possible option diminishes trans people and genderqueer people as people whose gender identities are legitimate. We use words to define things, including the difference between people who ascribe to the gender assigned to them at birth and people who don't.

Do you think rape jokes are acceptable?

calm down, i just said that to piss you off anyway.  but, it's still a pretty young word (coined on the internet), and a word that's appropriate in a clinical context isn't necessarily applicable to the rest of the world.  i haven't heard a physician use it, for instance.  and i damn sure didn't think that 'calling cisassination' or whatever it was was appropriate in the context of this thread.  i found it offensive.

there are already words for people who are not transgendered.  and, gender identities that are called into question by the owner of both the birth gender and their identifying gender, even if solidified by that same person, are still identities that have been called into question.  legitimate or not is not the issue i actually take with your posts.

don't get me wrong.  i am not in dispute of a transgender community nor am i faced with any problems with the issue itself.  it's been, however, established that i have a problem with many aspects of activism, and while i am glad to see an emerging language and attempt at structuring the admittedly complicated aspects of gender identity and how it relates to the physical body, we just aren't there yet.   getting there, but not there yet.  and once 'we' get there, well, guess what.  one still has to wait on society to dilute it into something they can understand, or at least feel some empathy for.  otherwise, they're never going to accept.

frankly, i prefer the buck angel approach to educating people about transgender issues.  it's much simpler.



do i think rape jokes are acceptable?  i make them, don't i?  at a 'take back the night' gathering, probably not, no.  but yes, i think almost any topic is acceptable as a joke in the right context.  nothing is intrinsically sacred, after all, and nothing exists in nature to define 'right' from 'wrong.'  those are human concepts, and they derive from us thinking it isn't fair that we have to suffer and then die, much less watch others do same.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #124 on: July 22, 2011, 03:47:02 PM »

The mere fact that you have deigned it necessary to correct someone's misuse of a pronoun without taking into account any aspect of the situation as it pertains to intent means that you, in fact, ARE judging. What's worse, you're judging without facts but based upon assumptions. Judging before you had a grasp of the specific situation. Pre-judging one might say.

Another way of saying "Pre-judging" is...?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #125 on: July 22, 2011, 03:52:08 PM »

prejiudice.  which is why political correctness comes full circle into exclusivity.


it's just another form of exclusion, really.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #126 on: July 22, 2011, 10:45:11 PM »

Can I say something?

I am naïve. There is no getting around that but that is because due to me being an aspy, I tend to get frustrated and angry. I then tend to say things that I don’t mean and then everything goes to shit.

I love this forum because I have made some really nice friends and for the longest time, I didn’t want to say anything concerning my views because I was afraid I was going to get judged. Well, I should learn not to say anything because that’s what happened.

But I’m not going to be sorry for being a Christian. I’m sorry if I offended anyone because that was not my intention. I wanted to have a mature, adult conversation and instead, it turned into a “Mockery is an idiot” thread.  I have nothing against gay people but I don’t agree with their life style. They still have a right to be happy and I won’t stand in their way. 

And if I have come off as BB put, “misogynistic, sexist, anti-feminist, homophobic, fatphobic, slut-shaming, ignorant” then I am sorry! Apparently, this not the place for me so I’ll leave ya’ll too it. But seems to me that no here will let me have an opinon because when I do, I end up getting attacked. It’s not fair is it?

I doubt I’ll be posting on this thread anymore because everything I say doesn’t seem to matter. Go ahead and call me troll, naïve or whatever but I honestly don’t give a flying fuck anymore.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #127 on: July 23, 2011, 02:02:29 AM »

i'm locking this thread for a few days.

the discussion is getting too personal.
and disrespectful.
a cooling off period is in order

those who are posting in this thread might want to re-read all of
http://www.theshadowbox.net/forum/index.php?topic=12409.0

i just excerpted the parts that apply here:

***

- Don't be abusive to board members, k? K. Arguments will happen - and that's fine - but please don't make correcting or belittling others your mission here. No one here is in a position to lay into others for small mistakes, and if the majority of your posts consist of you giving attitude to others here, you will be warned (and ultimately removed). If someone makes a typo or forgets to use the search function, we ask that you politely point out the mistake (or ignore it altogether).
Examples include (but are not limited to):
* Harassment * Posting of (or paraphrasing from) off-Box/private conversations without consent * Posting of images of other members without their consent (this is only enforced if people complain) * Misuse of the Private Messaging system will lead to the loss of your ability to send and receive PMs * Mockery through the likes of "impersonations", and other similar behaviors.

***

- If a thread you created is deleted/moved/locked, DO NOT MAKE IT AGAIN. If you have a question about it, please PM a moderator to discuss it there. Also, if it appears that your thread is "missing", check to see if it has been moved to another section of the board.

***

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #128 on: July 24, 2011, 09:00:33 PM »

unlocked

be kind to one another
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #129 on: July 24, 2011, 09:03:57 PM »

you're my rare gem, len.   O0
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #130 on: July 24, 2011, 10:30:24 PM »

I think you made a good decision Len!

I had just discovered this thread and thought it had potential but it really degenerated and got very, very subjective.

Subjective discussions are fine but it bothers me when people state their opinions as facts, as the one true way.

I want to give my opinions on the original topic of the thread:

I think the only really scientific definition you can use of mental illness is something that impairs your perception of objective reality, such as hallucinating.

I think that is the only definition you can use that will yield testable results which is necessary for it to be considered scientific.  The line between mood disorders of various types and just being emotional is arbitrarily defined.  There are reasons why people in the hard sciences have always been very critical of the soft sciences...

What I'm getting at is that I don't think it is accurate to refer to any abnormal sexual attraction as a "mental illness."  I agree with most people that a homosexual attraction towards adults is less offensive than a pedophiliac attraction but I want to say that that's a common opinion, and not a scientific distinction.

I'm not saying this to argue that we should not try to treat pedophiles or lock them up, just that pedophilia is probably just as hard to cure as it is to "cure" homosexuality.  "Curing" any abnormal sexualities likely would require major neurological remodeling that we are not even close to having the technology to do.  Hell, we can't even cure much simpler mental problems like alzheimer's.

I think most people would be tempted to believe that their sexualities can't be "wrong" so it makes sense that pedophiles would believe out of convenience that their victims can consent.  I remember one episode of Law and Order SVU where Benson scoffed at the idea that pedophiles could love their victims.  While I understand why people would scoff at that idea I'm sure that the neurological activity many pedophiles feel towards their crushes is identical to what "normal" people feel towards theirs.  So once again the distinction is not very scientific.

I know I'm kind of just rambling, but what I'm trying to say is that although I think we should lock up pedophiles I think we should do it to protect the children and not because of a primitive, false belief that the pedophiles just chose to be "evil".
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #131 on: July 24, 2011, 10:41:17 PM »



I think most people would be tempted to believe that their sexualities can't be "wrong" so it makes sense that pedophiles would believe out of convenience that their victims can consent.  I remember one episode of Law and Order SVU where Benson scoffed at the idea that pedophiles could love their victims.  While I understand why people would scoff at that idea I'm sure that the neurological activity many pedophiles feel towards their crushes is identical to what "normal" people feel towards theirs.  So once again the distinction is not very scientific.

You're addicted to eh?

And it's true, some pedophiles see their actions as pure because they believe it's innocent love. However, there are a lot of people who have those urges and they go through ways to deal with them by going to therapy or even getting rid of their genitals. Again, there are those groups who try to get equal rights by saying they're being persecuted for 'loving' a child. Do they ever stop to think about how the child feels? A child does not fully understand the concept of love and sex!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #132 on: July 24, 2011, 10:46:14 PM »



I think most people would be tempted to believe that their sexualities can't be "wrong" so it makes sense that pedophiles would believe out of convenience that their victims can consent.  I remember one episode of Law and Order SVU where Benson scoffed at the idea that pedophiles could love their victims.  While I understand why people would scoff at that idea I'm sure that the neurological activity many pedophiles feel towards their crushes is identical to what "normal" people feel towards theirs.  So once again the distinction is not very scientific.

You're addicted to eh?

And it's true, some pedophiles see their actions as pure because they believe it's innocent love. However, there are a lot of people who have those urges and they go through ways to deal with them by going to therapy or even getting rid of their genitals. Again, there are those groups who try to get equal rights by saying they're being persecuted for 'loving' a child. Do they ever stop to think about how the child feels? A child does not fully understand the concept of love and sex!

I agree.

But it is human nature to twist things to suit your desires.  Neither you, or I can really know how our perception might be warped if we instead developed the attraction to children.

I just know it is easy for me to see that children can't consent because I happen to be attracted to things like wide shoulders and defined cheek bones that little kids normally don't have.

And yes... it is a great show!  It can be hard for me to watch it sometimes because my paranoid brain worries about such predators attacking my female friends but I do like the show.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #133 on: July 24, 2011, 10:51:46 PM »



I think most people would be tempted to believe that their sexualities can't be "wrong" so it makes sense that pedophiles would believe out of convenience that their victims can consent.  I remember one episode of Law and Order SVU where Benson scoffed at the idea that pedophiles could love their victims.  While I understand why people would scoff at that idea I'm sure that the neurological activity many pedophiles feel towards their crushes is identical to what "normal" people feel towards theirs.  So once again the distinction is not very scientific.

You're addicted to eh?

And it's true, some pedophiles see their actions as pure because they believe it's innocent love. However, there are a lot of people who have those urges and they go through ways to deal with them by going to therapy or even getting rid of their genitals. Again, there are those groups who try to get equal rights by saying they're being persecuted for 'loving' a child. Do they ever stop to think about how the child feels? A child does not fully understand the concept of love and sex!

I agree.

But it is human nature to twist things to suit your desires.  Neither you, or I can really know how our perception might be warped if we instead developed the attraction to children.

I just know it is easy for me to see that children can't consent because I happen to be attracted to things like wide shoulders and defined cheek bones that little kids normally don't have.

And yes... it is a great show!  It can be hard for me to watch it sometimes because my paranoid brain worries about such predators attacking my female friends but I do like the show.
Gosh I know! My dad said the only reason I was allowed to watch the show as because it would teach me not to trust everyone.

Yes, humans like to twist things around but I've always noticed that people, no matter who they are hate to see harm come to children. That's why people where so pissed off about Casey A. I think it's because when we loose our innocence, we want to help persevere it for children and it's not fair when it gets taken away from them. At the same time, a lot of pedophiles realize that their is something wrong with their feelings towards children and go out of their way to stop it because they realize that what they do could hurts a child.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #134 on: July 24, 2011, 11:18:46 PM »



But it is human nature to twist things to suit your desires. 



this is the smartest sentence i have read in weeks.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #135 on: July 25, 2011, 01:53:07 AM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #136 on: July 25, 2011, 02:00:32 AM »

i got in trouble in a class in college for saying that the book the little prince seemed hella pedophilic to me.  it's a very awesome story, and i get how the boy reflects the man, but.....i guess if you separate the boy and the man, it seems creepy.  i read it young and it struck me creepy then, and i guess i never got it out of my head.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #137 on: July 25, 2011, 02:01:15 AM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.

I think people also don't realise there's several kinds of love, not all of which is sexual.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #138 on: July 25, 2011, 02:31:01 AM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.

I think people also don't realise there's several kinds of love, not all of which is sexual.

Indeed.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #139 on: July 25, 2011, 08:38:08 AM »

The big issue is that the English Language (and others as well) have one catch-all word to describe different types of love.

Love between friends.
Love between parents and offspring
Love between siblings
Amorous love
Love of career
Love of country (this one is debatable - the word "Patriot" gets used for this quite a bit in English)
Love of a group
Love of a mentor

These are just many different sorts of love off the top of my head. Language tends to focus by way of becoming more descriptive of that which it, as a society, finds important. Many Eskimo and Aleut tribes have as many as 12 different words to describe snow, depending upon moisture content, compact-ability, stickiness, hardness, etc. In English, we call all of it "snow".

If defining of love in exacting terms was a focus of the English-speaking world, my guess is we would have more words than just "love" to use as a descriptor.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #140 on: July 25, 2011, 05:54:23 PM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.

I think people also don't realise there's several kinds of love, not all of which is sexual.

In this day and age, only sex exists. There is no such thing as love.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #141 on: July 25, 2011, 06:01:40 PM »

Yes, except now your Love shall be known as Rhododendron. I expect you to now say, "I'm in Rhododendron with my fiancee."
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #142 on: July 25, 2011, 06:05:29 PM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.

I think people also don't realise there's several kinds of love, not all of which is sexual.

In this day and age, only sex exists. There is no such thing as love.

I'm in love.  Are you going to tell me my love doesn't exist?

Ugh. Hil, I'm not talking about you or anyone here.  I'm talking about all those stupid brain washed people who only think that sex matters in this day in age. I never said your love doesn't exist or that love isn't real. Get it?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #143 on: July 25, 2011, 06:08:24 PM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.

I think people also don't realise there's several kinds of love, not all of which is sexual.

In this day and age, only sex exists. There is no such thing as love.
Not even remotely true.

Wow, bumping us up the relationship ladder a bit quick, there!  I'm in Rhododendron with my boyfriend still works though.  In fact, I rather like the ring to it.
After 13 years we are very much in chrysanthemum. I look back fondly on our rhododendron days.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #144 on: July 25, 2011, 06:23:12 PM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.

I think people also don't realise there's several kinds of love, not all of which is sexual.

In this day and age, only sex exists. There is no such thing as love.
Not even remotely true.
Did you even read my other post or do you still consider me to be a troll?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #145 on: July 25, 2011, 06:24:53 PM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.

I think people also don't realise there's several kinds of love, not all of which is sexual.

In this day and age, only sex exists. There is no such thing as love.

this IS a pretty blanket statement, although i got your meaning.  easy to fall into traps like that without clarification, however.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #146 on: July 25, 2011, 06:27:00 PM »

There's that wonderful movie called Leon which was criticized for being pedophilic, but i don't think it is. Leon just loves and protects Mathilda. Sometimes pure love can be confused with lust in people's mind.

I think people also don't realise there's several kinds of love, not all of which is sexual.

In this day and age, only sex exists. There is no such thing as love.
Not even remotely true.
Did you even read my other post or do you still consider me to be a troll?
Not going to argue with you. You said something I disagreed with and I disagreed with it. Maybe you shouldn't make blanket statements.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #147 on: July 25, 2011, 06:29:27 PM »


And people say aspies take things to literally.

Anyways, we're in a culture that is obsessed with sex, sex, and more sex. TV shows, movies and sometimes even books only focus on the act of sex, obtaining someone to have sex with or having as much sex as you can. It's a sad reality that many young people are being brain washed into thinking that love isn't important. All that matters to them is sex.

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #148 on: July 25, 2011, 06:40:36 PM »

The big issue is that the English Language (and others as well) have one catch-all word to describe different types of love.

Love between friends.
Love between parents and offspring
Love between siblings
Amorous love
Love of career
Love of country (this one is debatable - the word "Patriot" gets used for this quite a bit in English)
Love of a group
Love of a mentor

These are just many different sorts of love off the top of my head. Language tends to focus by way of becoming more descriptive of that which it, as a society, finds important. Many Eskimo and Aleut tribes have as many as 12 different words to describe snow, depending upon moisture content, compact-ability, stickiness, hardness, etc. In English, we call all of it "snow".

If defining of love in exacting terms was a focus of the English-speaking world, my guess is we would have more words than just "love" to use as a descriptor.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_words_for_love
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #149 on: July 25, 2011, 07:08:56 PM »

The big issue is that the English Language (and others as well) have one catch-all word to describe different types of love.

Love between friends.
Love between parents and offspring
Love between siblings
Amorous love
Love of career
Love of country (this one is debatable - the word "Patriot" gets used for this quite a bit in English)
Love of a group
Love of a mentor

These are just many different sorts of love off the top of my head. Language tends to focus by way of becoming more descriptive of that which it, as a society, finds important. Many Eskimo and Aleut tribes have as many as 12 different words to describe snow, depending upon moisture content, compact-ability, stickiness, hardness, etc. In English, we call all of it "snow".

If defining of love in exacting terms was a focus of the English-speaking world, my guess is we would have more words than just "love" to use as a descriptor.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_words_for_love

missing a few.
but WP is a work in progress

if anyone wants to do the research on other languages,
with web links,
it should be fascinating
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #150 on: July 25, 2011, 07:31:45 PM »

And people say aspies take things to literally.

Anyways, we're in a culture that is obsessed with sex, sex, and more sex. TV shows, movies and sometimes even books only focus on the act of sex, obtaining someone to have sex with or having as much sex as you can. It's a sad reality that many young people are being brain washed into thinking that love isn't important. All that matters to them is sex.



there is a philosophy that states that everything anyone does ever at all is primarily to get laid.

it makes up a large part of my worldview, although i dont subscribe to it completely, because, well, i'm in love too.  i'm not going to lie and say a large part of our mutual attraction isn't because we absolutely sizzle in bed, though, because we totally do.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #151 on: July 25, 2011, 08:17:06 PM »

And people say aspies take things to literally.

Anyways, we're in a culture that is obsessed with sex, sex, and more sex. TV shows, movies and sometimes even books only focus on the act of sex, obtaining someone to have sex with or having as much sex as you can. It's a sad reality that many young people are being brain washed into thinking that love isn't important. All that matters to them is sex.



there is a philosophy that states that everything anyone does ever at all is primarily to get laid.

it makes up a large part of my worldview, although i dont subscribe to it completely, because, well, i'm in love too.  i'm not going to lie and say a large part of our mutual attraction isn't because we absolutely sizzle in bed, though, because we totally do.

I'm not totally condemning sex. Sex is great. Granted, I've still a virgin but God created it so we could be connected to our significant other in a deeper more emotional level. I just wish people would realize their is more to life than sex.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #152 on: July 25, 2011, 08:45:55 PM »

And people say aspies take things to literally.

Anyways, we're in a culture that is obsessed with sex, sex, and more sex. TV shows, movies and sometimes even books only focus on the act of sex, obtaining someone to have sex with or having as much sex as you can. It's a sad reality that many young people are being brain washed into thinking that love isn't important. All that matters to them is sex.



there is a philosophy that states that everything anyone does ever at all is primarily to get laid.

it makes up a large part of my worldview, although i dont subscribe to it completely, because, well, i'm in love too.  i'm not going to lie and say a large part of our mutual attraction isn't because we absolutely sizzle in bed, though, because we totally do.

I'm not totally condemning sex. Sex is great. Granted, I've still a virgin but God created it so we could be connected to our significant other in a deeper more emotional level. I just wish people would realize their is more to life than sex.

well, there is.  there's all this stuff you can buy so that people will have sex with you.  and, there's money.  people like to have sex with money when it is all over someone else.


in more than one way, sex is life.  there is a lot of danger in trivializing sex that doesn't make life, too.  the entire of western civilization can be connected back to sex.  not having sex still entails making a decision about sex, and in all probability waiting for it, unless one decides never to have it, in which case it still exists as a reality of their existence.

really, it's so all-encompassing because it is kinda....all-encompassing.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #153 on: July 25, 2011, 08:50:43 PM »

And people say aspies take things to literally.

Anyways, we're in a culture that is obsessed with sex, sex, and more sex. TV shows, movies and sometimes even books only focus on the act of sex, obtaining someone to have sex with or having as much sex as you can. It's a sad reality that many young people are being brain washed into thinking that love isn't important. All that matters to them is sex.



there is a philosophy that states that everything anyone does ever at all is primarily to get laid.

it makes up a large part of my worldview, although i dont subscribe to it completely, because, well, i'm in love too.  i'm not going to lie and say a large part of our mutual attraction isn't because we absolutely sizzle in bed, though, because we totally do.

I'm not totally condemning sex. Sex is great. Granted, I've still a virgin but God created it so we could be connected to our significant other in a deeper more emotional level. I just wish people would realize their is more to life than sex.

well, there is.  there's all this stuff you can buy so that people will have sex with you.  and, there's money.  people like to have sex with money when it is all over someone else.


in more than one way, sex is life.  there is a lot of danger in trivializing sex that doesn't make life, too.  the entire of western civilization can be connected back to sex.  not having sex still entails making a decision about sex, and in all probability waiting for it, unless one decides never to have it, in which case it still exists as a reality of their existence.

really, it's so all-encompassing because it is kinda....all-encompassing.
My mind has just been blown!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #154 on: August 01, 2011, 01:04:27 PM »

indeed sex is used as part of social bonding in many animals...particularly bonobo chimpanzees (one of our closest relatives and some zoologists and anthropologists reckon that chimpanzees should actually be considered part of the hominid line, albeit a distant one....rather than a seperate genus of apes) actively use sex as part of their social grouping and also simply for pleasure...they are noted for their diplays of masturbation and also of same sex couplings for pleasure or group bonding...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonobo
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #155 on: August 01, 2011, 01:11:48 PM »

as opposed to common chimpanzees, bonobo's are hyper sexual in habits.....also they seem generally smarter and have a much more complex vocal communication.......also they can pass several self awareness tests and can learn complex symbolic language..both sign language and symbol based keyboard communication......bloody fascinating creatures and a real insight into what we were like at our earlier stages of human evolution......worth noting that we probably only genetically diverged from them a s recently as 7million years ago there is evidence that the final split was actually much later, with a fair amount of hybridisation going on for several million years.....
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/05/humans-chimps.html
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #156 on: August 01, 2011, 01:25:10 PM »

Chimps are so perverse and they love it.  Nobody wants to see their kids watch a chimp masturbating with a big grin on it's face and saying 'what's he doing?'  It's funny to watch the parents watch that in horror, though.

we spent a week or so in high school watching the jane goodall footage from the seventies, and her discoveries of chimp society.  in the wild, those guys can be pretty evil.  it's odd to think of the little cannibals wearing a diaper and co-starring in tv series when you see them pitching a fit and racially persecuting baboons.

of course, baboons aren't much nicer.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #157 on: August 01, 2011, 01:29:02 PM »

the chimps you saw were common chimps...their social structure and general behaviour is radically different to the behaviour of Bonobos...one could argue that bonobos are the more socially advanced "civilised" species of chimpanzee and they certainly have much more complex communicative adaptations than their common chimpanzee relatives.....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #158 on: August 01, 2011, 01:35:06 PM »

honestly had no idea there was a difference.  my chimp lore is pretty halted with goodall's old footage and studies.  i've seen that she has a new series on apes, and have wanted to learn more about her last twenty years or so of research, but i just haven't had the opportunity to start watching, which of course would lead me to reading.

although, i seem to have inadvertently caused an uprising of all the primates at the birmingham zoo, at one time.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #159 on: August 01, 2011, 01:37:26 PM »

what did you do?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #160 on: August 01, 2011, 02:33:37 PM »

i was at the zoo because i was having some sort of awful day, and i think i was recovering from some illness or injury, and my girlfriend at the time was trying to cheer me up; it's a nice zoo with well-treated and well-housed animals (they even take various exotic rescues), so it's a happy place.  i don't remember what i was depressed about, only that i was beginning to feel better and cheer up, and we walked by the gorilla pavilion.  i was talking to her and in the course of conversation, mimed a gorilla chest-pound, and one of the males saw me and was highly offended.  he stood up and postured at me, and dared me to come across the wall-and-moat thing they had for the outdoor section of the gorilla pavilion.  we walked on, to keep him from getting more upset, although it was kind of funny, since we were safe.  he followed, grunting and gesturing for me to come back and fight.  it is unsettling to be looked in the eye with that much intelligence, and malevolence.

as we walked down the sidewalk to the primate house, i could see him following us.  the last thing i saw till the wall put me out of sight was his angry head glaring at me from over the wall, where he had climbed up on a rock to watch us go.  he must have contacted the baboons, because as soon as you walk in the primate house, there is a large glass wall with the baboon house on the other side.  the largest male caught one sight of me, puffed up, gave a mighty leap to a small ledge by the glass, and started pounding the glass to get to me, screaming for my blood.  as we walked by, he followed, pissed as hell and banging on the glass whenever he could get up to it (their house had kind of a moat to it as well).  the other baboons didn't take notice, but the alpha was clearly upset with me being there.

i asked an animal tender what might have happened; the gorilla was obvious, i'd been stupid and made a gesture that he took offense to, and rightly so.  he had little ones and females to defend, he didn't know what i was about.  interestingly, though the handler said of course they get that all the time from guys playing as they go by the gorillas and he (the gorilla) never seemed to react or took it seriously.  and, he said, baboons are just crazy, so it was coincidental.

most of the smaller monkeys hid from us, even though they had been playing with people.  however, on that same visit, a tree sloth hugged me.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #161 on: August 01, 2011, 09:08:05 PM »

God created it so we could be connected to our significant other in a deeper more emotional level.

I respect that, but there are many more purposes to sex.  If that were the only reason it was created, there wouldn't be brothels and hot, dumb girls wouldn't get promotions. 

Who said there wasn't more to sex? I'm just saying that's one of the resasons for sex.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #162 on: August 02, 2011, 03:46:47 AM »

I think it was the statement itself which intimated that that was the only reason, even if that was not what you were trying to convey.........the little sidestep into primates was to show how close we actually are to our nearest living relatives and how they use sex as an integral part of their social behaviour....they do not mate for life but enjoy a highly promiscuous and free lifestyle...the only sexual taboo bonobos seem to have is mother/son pairing....
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #163 on: August 06, 2011, 03:15:06 PM »

And people say aspies take things to literally.

Anyways, we're in a culture that is obsessed with sex, sex, and more sex. TV shows, movies and sometimes even books only focus on the act of sex, obtaining someone to have sex with or having as much sex as you can. It's a sad reality that many young people are being brain washed into thinking that love isn't important. All that matters to them is sex.



I think the culture only reflects human nature in this case.

And I don't think the culture is brain washing people into thinking love isn't important at all.  That is like saying that a culture could brain wash someone into being gay.  It is really damn hard to brain wash someone into doing something that is very against their nature.

...in fact, I think our culture is about as friendly to the idea of "true love" as it gets.  Love is glorified in so many songs and movies that barely if at all mention sex.  Throughout most of history and most of the world marriages were/are generally arranged for political and financial reasons and women were/are told they are wicked if they don't fall in love with the man who essentially buys them.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #164 on: August 24, 2011, 05:56:59 PM »

And people say aspies take things to literally.

Anyways, we're in a culture that is obsessed with sex, sex, and more sex. TV shows, movies and sometimes even books only focus on the act of sex, obtaining someone to have sex with or having as much sex as you can. It's a sad reality that many young people are being brain washed into thinking that love isn't important. All that matters to them is sex.



I think the culture only reflects human nature in this case.

And I don't think the culture is brain washing people into thinking love isn't important at all.  That is like saying that a culture could brain wash someone into being gay.  It is really damn hard to brain wash someone into doing something that is very against their nature.

...in fact, I think our culture is about as friendly to the idea of "true love" as it gets.  Love is glorified in so many songs and movies that barely if at all mention sex.  Throughout most of history and most of the world marriages were/are generally arranged for political and financial reasons and women were/are told they are wicked if they don't fall in love with the man who essentially buys them.

I don't know. I just feel like people are starting to care more about causal sex than love and it makes me kinda of sad. Sex is great but love is more important. I would rather have someone love me for who I am than just wanted to randomly fuck me.

And now total frog is coming to come and destroy me.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #165 on: August 24, 2011, 06:15:00 PM »

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/2cXDgFwE13g" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/2cXDgFwE13g</a>

This is what i want to happen to all of those goddamn pedophiles!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #166 on: August 24, 2011, 06:22:36 PM »

Whoa, someone seems mad today!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #167 on: August 24, 2011, 09:22:21 PM »

love has never been a priority.  marriages used to be arranged according to who gets the land.  love only matters to those who want it.  if it could actually fix anything, it would probably have a higher priority, but love is self-indulgent and does not last, sometimes.  it's no basis for permanence, not without actual work.

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #168 on: August 25, 2011, 12:24:33 PM »

love has never been a priority.  marriages used to be arranged according to who gets the land.  love only matters to those who want it.  if it could actually fix anything, it would probably have a higher priority, but love is self-indulgent and does not last, sometimes.  it's no basis for permanence, not without actual work.



I don't know if I believe that.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #169 on: August 25, 2011, 12:41:03 PM »

love has never been a priority.  marriages used to be arranged according to who gets the land.  love only matters to those who want it.  if it could actually fix anything, it would probably have a higher priority, but love is self-indulgent and does not last, sometimes.  it's no basis for permanence, not without actual work.



I don't know if I believe that.

i've had plenty of relationships wherein if love was all we had, it would not be enough to sustain it.....and wasn't.  love was never the problem.  it's fine to love someone, but giving it the importance over all else is a mistake.  i've seen parents indulge their kids almost to death because they 'loved them too much' to correct them.  my own mother, i am certain, loved me to distraction, but she still damaged me almost irreparably, because she was crazy.  love didn't cure or conquer her nuttiness.

love doesn't cure anything.  if anything, love is a tonic or a soothing thing, not a solution.  love doesn't make the world go around, gravity and force and sciency stuff does.  loving someone coming at you with a knife in their hand won't protect you.  and love is not the basic force in a relationship.  i wouldnt be able to stand being with some of the people i have loved in my life, but i loved them like crazy nonetheless.

and, marriage was never about love.  it was a legal contract.  no one got to be with whom they loved, that was considered irresponsible and outside the marriage itself, unless you happened to fall in love with your spouse, in which case, well done and lucky you.  marriage and love play a huge part in literature, but the truth is, it existed as a legal/religious matter, not an emotional one.  two hundred years ago, i'd be married off to some fucktard instead of happily living with my girlfriend, and trying to figure out how to kill him so i could inherit the land my father would have left him instead of me.  or whatever.  you have no idea how free we are to actually fall in love now, compared to then.  hell, marriage is still a legal contract, or it wouldn't be in such hot debate over whether or not gays can do it.  no reason why they shouldn't, if it is all about love, right?  but it isn't.  people add morality and politics to it, without even blinking, because that's what it is about.

our language is also woefully inept at describing love.  there is filial love, avuncular love, erotic love, self-indulgent love.......there are at least a hundred different ways to love another person, or group of people.  patriotism, even, is a form of love.  'love' is too generic a term to apply to one's life in a practical way.  no matter how much you love someone there are eyeroll moments.  and i have seen plenty of spouses who hate one another's guts, but are too bogged down in the hamster reflex to just let one another go.  but if you asked them, they would say yeah, we love each other, even if he/she is a fucktard.

i'm not saying love isn't important.  but it's the worst kind of naivete to think that it is all one needs...or even the most important thing.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #170 on: August 25, 2011, 12:47:06 PM »

I'm just saying that love is important in any relationship. I wouldn't marry someone just because they were good at sex and attractive.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #171 on: August 25, 2011, 12:51:12 PM »

i totally made an amazing post, but it got lost on the last page.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #172 on: August 25, 2011, 03:08:53 PM »

I'm just saying that love is important in any relationship. I wouldn't marry someone just because they were good at sex and attractive.

That's not just what you were saying though.  You brought up the issue of casual sex vs love - we're not attacking you, we're discussing what you brought up. 

'just saying' is a saying. You do realize that don't ya dear?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #173 on: August 25, 2011, 03:14:03 PM »

I'm just saying that love is important in any relationship. I wouldn't marry someone just because they were good at sex and attractive.

That's not just what you were saying though.  You brought up the issue of casual sex vs love - we're not attacking you, we're discussing what you brought up. 

'just saying' is a saying. You do realize that don't ya dear?

Don't call me dear.  And don't be patronising.

Sorry!  :embarassed:
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #174 on: August 25, 2011, 07:53:41 PM »


I read it and completely agree with it.  That was pretty much all I had to say about it so thought I would leave it for Mockery to respond to. 

there's really no point in serious discussion, though.  clearly if that were the point we'd get more than just a dismissive one-liner, time and again.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #175 on: August 26, 2011, 08:29:13 AM »


I read it and completely agree with it.  That was pretty much all I had to say about it so thought I would leave it for Mockery to respond to. 

there's really no point in serious discussion, though.  clearly if that were the point we'd get more than just a dismissive one-liner, time and again.

Some people are just incapable of discussion.  I think it comes from fear.

fear is generally the precursor to a closed mind.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #176 on: August 26, 2011, 02:23:28 PM »

love has never been a priority.  marriages used to be arranged according to who gets the land.  love only matters to those who want it.  if it could actually fix anything, it would probably have a higher priority, but love is self-indulgent and does not last, sometimes.  it's no basis for permanence, not without actual work.



I don't know if I believe that.

i've had plenty of relationships wherein if love was all we had, it would not be enough to sustain it.....and wasn't.  love was never the problem.  it's fine to love someone, but giving it the importance over all else is a mistake.  i've seen parents indulge their kids almost to death because they 'loved them too much' to correct them.  my own mother, i am certain, loved me to distraction, but she still damaged me almost irreparably, because she was crazy.  love didn't cure or conquer her nuttiness.

love doesn't cure anything.  if anything, love is a tonic or a soothing thing, not a solution.  love doesn't make the world go around, gravity and force and sciency stuff does.  loving someone coming at you with a knife in their hand won't protect you.  and love is not the basic force in a relationship.  i wouldnt be able to stand being with some of the people i have loved in my life, but i loved them like crazy nonetheless.

and, marriage was never about love.  it was a legal contract.  no one got to be with whom they loved, that was considered irresponsible and outside the marriage itself, unless you happened to fall in love with your spouse, in which case, well done and lucky you.  marriage and love play a huge part in literature, but the truth is, it existed as a legal/religious matter, not an emotional one.  two hundred years ago, i'd be married off to some fucktard instead of happily living with my girlfriend, and trying to figure out how to kill him so i could inherit the land my father would have left him instead of me.  or whatever.  you have no idea how free we are to actually fall in love now, compared to then.  hell, marriage is still a legal contract, or it wouldn't be in such hot debate over whether or not gays can do it.  no reason why they shouldn't, if it is all about love, right?  but it isn't.  people add morality and politics to it, without even blinking, because that's what it is about.

our language is also woefully inept at describing love.  there is filial love, avuncular love, erotic love, self-indulgent love.......there are at least a hundred different ways to love another person, or group of people.  patriotism, even, is a form of love.  'love' is too generic a term to apply to one's life in a practical way.  no matter how much you love someone there are eyeroll moments.  and i have seen plenty of spouses who hate one another's guts, but are too bogged down in the hamster reflex to just let one another go.  but if you asked them, they would say yeah, we love each other, even if he/she is a fucktard.

i'm not saying love isn't important.  but it's the worst kind of naivete to think that it is all one needs...or even the most important thing.

I read it and completely agree with it.  That was pretty much all I had to say about it so thought I would leave it for Mockery to respond to. 

Did I ever say that all one needs is love? I don't think I did. I just think it's important in a relationship.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #177 on: August 26, 2011, 05:10:00 PM »

I'd like to get back on the subject at hand!
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #178 on: August 26, 2011, 05:31:52 PM »

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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #179 on: August 30, 2011, 07:12:13 AM »

I'd like to get back on the subject at hand!

well clearly you're not being clear enough about the replies that you want to receive so why don't you provide some specific guidelines with each of your messages to help people construct appropriate and adequate responses to your posts?
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #180 on: August 30, 2011, 01:33:33 PM »

i know i won't be taking the bait again.
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #181 on: August 31, 2011, 08:10:55 AM »

The best way to get yourself ignored is to be an awkward bugger.
Or to bugger awkwardly...
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Re: Pedophila Today
« Reply #182 on: October 26, 2012, 02:31:47 AM »

All i am going to say is how disturbing i find to see how in websites like 9gag, they are constantly making pedo bear jokes as if it was funny at all, or when a naked baby picture is posted some call it child pornography....just disturbing....
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